Several planes look a little odd, or have attachments that look odd, and so some people feel they must be part of a decades long conspiracy to spray stuff into the atmosphere to alter the weather or reduce the population. That’s obviously nonsense, but what are these strange planes?
[Update: there are many other photos like the “barrel” interior below, I’ve collected a lot of them on Metabunk]
Here’s one making the rounds, scary looking barrels, and a sign on the wall that possibly says “Hazmat inside”
What is it? It’s a Boeing 777-200LR Worldliner, specifically it’s WD001, a plane that was used for flight testing. The original photo can be found here – note the “Hazmat” text was added later. The barrels contain water, which is pumped around to shift the center of gravity to test various flight characteristics.
Here’s a description of a similar setup from the 2002 book, “Inside Boeing, Building the 777”, page 76., describing tests done in 1994.
From Boeing’s blog:
Remember, we test at the extremes of the weight/CG envelope. This requires us to control the CG during ground and flight conditions. We can move weight, in the form of water, forward or aft with the use of the water ballast system. This system is comprised of 48 barrels, each capable of carrying 460 pounds, connected by tubing to a pump. A computerized system tracks fuel placement, fuel burn, people placement, ballast, flap setting, landing gear position and water barrel quantity. The information is processed to display the airplane’s current CG. We move water or specify fuel tank usage to configure the CG within the specified test requirements.
Why are there overhead luggage compartments? It’s a test plane, and for FAA certification they have to demonstrate that everything works. That includes stuff like the emergency oxygen system, and more minor things like the luggage compartments. It’s a requirement that they don’t pop open in flight – so that needs to be tested. They are also handy for stowing the engineers’ stuff.
Here’s some pictures from Boeing:
And a lot more photos can be found on Boeing’s site.
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This one gets a lot of use in the “chemtrail” forums:
Particularly because of the unusual collections of pipes sticking out in various places. There’s those two at the front, and then there is a group over the wing. Here’s some close ups
:
Very sinister looking tubes, but why are half of them facing the wrong way?
The plane is not for spraying the atmosphere, it’s for sampling the atmosphere. It’s a research aircraft, registration N701BN, operated by th e department of energy’s national labs. It’s pretty much one of a kind, so it’s hardly likely to be responsible for all the persistent contrails we see every day. The research is mostly on pollutants in the atmosphere, particularly from coal and oil burning power plants. But they also investigate the properties of clouds, which includes contrails.
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Here’s another photo you see in “chemtrail” videos, with the implied suggestion that it’s some kind of evil spraying device:
Actually it IS a spraying device, but quite innocuous. It’s on an NKC-135A (55-3128) with the refueling boom modified to spray water. This used by the air force to test icing of planes in flight.
Here’s the original photo:
See also: https://www.safaq.hq.af.mil/news/march04/raptor.html
Here’s some more details:
nkc-135-icing-attachmentpv1983_2688.pdf
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This plane is quite interesting:
It’s an E-6B “Tacamo”. This photo shows it dumping fuel (photo from tacamo.org). The E-6B is used by the United States Strategic Command as an airborne communication center. You can see the navy logo on the right wing. The E-6B is a modified version of the Boeing 707-320, and the fuel vents have been moved from the wing tips to between the fuselage and the engines in order to separate it from the communication equipment in the wing tips. This is what the wing-tip ESM/SATCOM pod looks like:
It looks like this odd assemblage is also creating some wingtip vortex contrails as well. The plane is pretty much all white, which is something you hear mentioned from time to time in “chemtrail” conspiracy theories.
Here’s another photo of the same plane, taken from a “chemtrail” YouTube video:
It shows the opening and drogue for the ELF trailing wire antenna. This is a very long wire antenna that is extended behind the plane for several hundred feet and used for communications with submarines. The “drogue” is just a cone-shaped weight. Here’s a close-up
http://www.flickr.com/photos/coldwararchaeology/5180470207/in/photostream
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This plane also looks at first glance like it might be dumping fuel (click image for full sized photo):
But the trails are actually coming from six smoke generators. It was part of a NASA test to study wake vortices, you can read about it here:
http://www.dfrc.nasa.gov/Gallery/Photo/B-747/HTML/ECN-4242.html
Six smoke generators were installed under the wings of the 747 to provide a visual image of the trailing vortices. The object of the experiments was to test different configurations and mechanical devices on the747 that could be used to break up or lessen the strength of the vortices. The results of the tests could lead to shorter spacing between landings and takeoffs, which, in turn, could alleviate air-traffic congestion.
Here’s another image of the same plane:
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This plane also occasionally get brought up in chemtrail conspiracy groups:
This is obviously not a contrail, it’s far too low and the trail is dropping too rapidly.
It’s a Boeing 747-100 “Supertanker”, modified by Evergreen Aviation, the only one of its kind. Specifically designed for fire fighthing. That’s it dumping water. Here’s some more recent photos.
Here’s a video of it in action, titled “B747 chemtrails”. It’s interesting reading the comments, as the first comment correctly identifies what it is, and then everyone else just ignores that and starts speculating.
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This one looks like a plane spraying stuff. But again it’s rather close to the ground. It’s actually taking off with the assistance of rockets. It’s not spraying, that’s just rocket exhaust.
This particular plane is a Boeing B-47B, rocket assisted take off, April 15, 1954. An no, that’s not a contrail in the sky behind it – it’s rip in the photo. Click on it for a large version from Wikipedia.
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This one is used for cloud seeding. It does not actually spray anything but uses silver iodine flares that are either ejected, or burn in place.
It’s operated by the Sandy land Underground Water Conservation district of Plains, Texas, as part of their SOAR program. They have some more photos of similar equipment on their site. They are all small aircraft not capable of getting to the above 30,000 feet where contrails normally form.
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This next photo is also of silver iodine flares, fixed underneath at large plane.
These also show up in “chemtrail” literature. They are sold by Weather Modification Inc, they make a range of weather modification equipment. About this one they say:
WMI racks for ejectable flares are mounted on the belly of the aircraft fuselage. Each rack holds 102 cartridges. When fired, the pyrotechnic is ignited and ejected from the aircraft. In this configuration, the WMI Lear 35A is equipped with four 102-count racks for ejectable glaciogenic pyrotechnics, a total of 408 flares.
Here’s another, this time from North American Weather Consultants, Inc.
About which they say:
This aircraft-mounted cloud seeding generator is fixed in place, and can burn a silver iodide solution during flight.
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This one is the “Mk.32 drogue-type underwing pod on the Armée de l’Air Boeing C-135FR Stratotanker” (“93-CC”- s/n 63-8472 of GRV 93). It’s an in-flight refueling system on a French Boeing C-135FR Stratotanker, photographed in Canada, Feb 2005.
See: http://www.baha.be/Webpages/Navigator/News/tanker_flight_240205.htm
The following is supposed to be a plane that has “chemtrail aerosol nozzles” over three of the engines.
In reality, this plane N707MQ is a Boeing 707-320B. The engines are Pratt & Whitney JT3D-3:
http://www.airliners.net/photo/Omega-Tanker/Boeing-707-321B/1622886/M/
It should be perfectly obvious that the “nozzles” are facing the wrong way to be spraying anything. They are actually turbocompressors, which are driven by engine bleed air, and are used to pressurize the interior of the plane. There are only three, as that’s all you need. Here’s a discussion:
http://www.airliners.net/aviation-forums/tech_ops/read.main/8225/
“…There are many egos involved in scientific fields as well as other drivers such as money and power. ”
But, the way water vapor will behave in any given conditions is well understood. No amount of money or power will ever change that fact. These trails behave exactly how they are expected to behave given the VERY simple science that explains them.
There are many claims coming from the chemtrail hoax accepters that claim these trails aren’t acting as they should, yet no one has been able to explain why or even show a single trail that has formed in conditions not conducive to persistent contrail creation. There is a very good reason for that.
My comment was a response to this staetment above:
“religion is based on belief… science is based on evidence.”
I was simply stating Science is just another part of the bureaucracy and is completely manipulated and controlled for a bunch of reasons that have little to do with science.
I’m interested in what A.C Griffith talks about on Collins Andrews Blog, It’s all very far fetched but there are significant past black projects and even sprayings of citizens with experimental pollutants which seemed far fetched at the time but are just history now. I’m interested in the evidence and the theories and question all sources with ridicule for such subjects as Chemtrails.
I try not to assume too much but I feel fairly certain every part of every infrastructure in the world is manipulated for all sorts of reasons, right and wrong. Not necessarily by some INWO organized to control us all but by default, they don’t work together, but against each other using us as pawns to gain more and more power and control.
“I was simply stating Science is just another part of the bureaucracy and is completely manipulated and controlled for a bunch of reasons that have little to do with science.”
That’s quite the blanket statement! You use the word “completely” and that’s just BULLSHIT! I happen to know many people who are passionate about the science they have made a career out of understanding. One being the department head of the chemistry department of a very prestigious university. Are you actually suggesting that what they believe to be the facts, are just bureaucratic BS?!
I think you need to learn to use words like “in my opinion….” and “it’s my belief that….”. Also, I suggest that you learn not to lump all scientists into one group. Sure, there are obviously “some” that are out to make a name for themselves selling junk science to the ignorant, such as Clifford Carnicom, but not all scientists are like that. Besides, the scientific method and peer review are in place to prevent such nonsense (please notice how NOTHING Mr Carnicom spreads as fact about “chemtrails” has passed peer review). Why are you trying to suggest that all of science is corrupt?! That is just so ridiculous!
It seems you are suggesting that ALL of scientific knowledge is tainted by those seeking wealth and power. I strongly disagree.
I think jax speaks as one who has not had much experience with actual scientists.
The areas of science where there might be political influence are those where there is some considerable uncertainty. The way water should and does behave, both in the lab and in the air, is not really one of those areas. Any plot to cover up a sudden change in the supposed behavior of water would have to include tens of millions of scientists across the globe, and to alter many millions of text books, newspapers, and even personal photo albums dating back over 90 years.
It’s basically impossible.
Jax
What statements specifically? Does he give any evidence?
I can see low flying planes leaving chemtrails that are clearly not contrails. This picture I’m uploading shows the trail broken in several places. Contrails don’t look like this ever!
[img]https://contrailscience.com/wp-content/uploads/IMAG0106.jpg[/img]
The Facts Matter =P,
“That’s quite the blanket statement! You use the word “completely” and that’s just BULLSHIT!”
Yes it is I agree and I am comfortable using that generalization regarding ANY infrastructure on the planet (I guess I wasn’t being clear enough). Of course there are always the exclusions to the rule but it is the cause and effect of the nature of human beings and the state we have created for ourselves to corrupt and manipulate from every angle for whatever greedy reasoning.
I have very close friends whom are scientists but I won’t get into a pissing contest referring to THEIR roles. As a result I know that they are all doing things close to their desired fields (around the world) but not one of them is actually running projects they really want to do. It’s the way of the world, there are of course those people who do get to do the research they want to do, but it’s not a Turkey shoot getting roles like that, they are rare and of course they come with their prices as well.
It doesn’t take a genius or a scientist to know that what turns the human world is not scientific and moral en devour, it’s POWAH my friend, the real power doesn’t come from money or science.
Cheers Unicinus,
The blog I referred to is here:
http://www.colinandrews.net/Whistleblowers-Chemtrails.html
A.C Griffith makes some seriously outrageous statements which he claims to know of from first hand experience having been inside the Chemtrail project named “Cloverleaf” or something. He has some credentials but little evidence other than testimony.
I’d like to hear objective views views and researched answers if anyone has anything to offer, rather than Knee jerk “FAKE” calls from backyard geniuses ^_~’.
Night, Peace Out
JAX
Here is a picture I took the same day within seconds of the other picture. This plane is clearly not leaving contrails.
[img]https://contrailscience.com/wp-content/uploads/IMAG0105.jpg[/img]
Todd. See this photo from before 1972:
[img]https://contrailscience.com/wp-content/uploads/cotw-1124w.jpg[/img]
Contrails do look like that sometimes. I see it quite often. If you want the explanation why, check this out:
http://picasaweb.google.com/Uncinus/CloudsOfTheWorld1972?feat=embedwebsite#
Why is you second plane not leaving contrails? It looks just like it is. It’s probably very high.
Well, unless they can produce some actual evidence, I’d say that Griffith and Gunderson are either making stuff up, or are deluded.
Is any of Griffith’s stuff written down? I don’t have time to watch videos.
“Yes it is I agree and I am comfortable using that generalization regarding ANY infrastructure on the planet.”
Of course, but it’s still opinion with nothing to back it up.
“Of course there are always the exclusions to the rule..”
Where is the evidence that your position isn’t the exception to the rule?! It’s my opinion that the MAJORITY of science actually cares about the truth. This is why we have BENEFITED from science the way we have! If it wasn’t anything more than bureaucratic BS, we wouldn’t have the benefit! There wouldn’t be any computers, cars, composite materials and BILLIONS of other products that science has given us! Also, please provide ANY evidence that the way water vapor reacts within any environment has been faked. Again, your position is ridiculous. I don’t expect you to be able to convince me otherwise. The trails in the sky behave EXACTLY how they are expected to.
It’s my opinion that you simply have a negative and paranoid world view (there is plenty of evidence to support that claim). If you can provide me with examples that indicate that the “majority” of science is BS, I’d gladly reconsider. But, considering it’s such an absurd position and there is absolutely NO WAY you could possibly prove such a ridiculous position, I must conclude that you…Oops, I almost went against the politeness policy again! I’ll let your imagination fill in that blank. You obviously have a very good imagination!
Todd…
There is no evidence that the two planes are flying within the same conditions. A few feet can make a HUGE difference in the way the trails behave. I have to wonder, are you under the impression that the atmosphere is exactly the same from ground level to space?! Sorry, that’s not correct. There are many layers and pockets/air masses that mingle around each other. If an area isn’t humid or cold enough, it won’t leave a persistent contrail.
@Todd
It isn’t leaving contrails? That sure looks like a contrail to me. Is there another subject I’m missing?
And @Jax
Two things I noticed about those videos:
1. The video shows pictures of ballast tanks in a test plane. Do they not know what those are, or are they being dishonest?
2. He’s completely useless as a whistleblower, why isn’t he sending documents to Julian Assange. Do we just have to take his word for it? And buy his book I imagine.
Doesn’t anyone else here think that it’s more than “odd” to make statements of fact and then back them up with nothing more than opinion?! Where do people learn to do this?!
No wonder there are so many paranoid people on the planet! They have convinced themselves that “belief” is all one needs to have an accurate world view.
So sad!
Todd said:
“I can see low flying planes leaving chemtrails that are clearly not contrails. This picture I’m uploading shows the trail broken in several places. Contrails don’t look like this ever!”
It is a picture of a dissipating contrail from a two-engine jet. I’ve seen this many times and taken a few photos myself. From this stage it will disappear completely within minutes. I posted here early some pictures of a dissipating four-engine contrail:
https://contrailscience.com/chemtrails-the-best-evidence/#comment-54677
And these are not low flying planes, they are flying at the cruising altitude of 10±1 km.
Uncinus: Both pictures show the same chemtrail from the same white militay plane. The plane was well below the clouds as you can see in the first pic I posted, the chemtrail is below the clouds. I am 50, lived here my whole life, I can say these trails are not normal. The way I found out there was an issue was like this; one Saturday I noticed many trails crossing each other. It was about 10 am. I noticed 2 planes passing leaving massive lines in the sky. I marked the time because typically commercial planes fly on a schedule. A typical plane will fly the same route at the same time every day. I watched for these planes at that time on the next Saturday and there was nothing. Over the last few weeks I’ve been documenting the times I see these planes, and there don’t follow a typical schedule. Last weekend I saw no less than 15 streaks that came into my area within an hour. These streaks were not following a typical flight path. I live in SW FL and planes almost never fly from east to west or the other way as there is nothing to the west other than the gulf of Mexico. There is no typical traffic that I documented flying East to west in my area, so when you see 5 or 6 chem trails going in that direction, crossing several that go north to south and back you have to wonder. But then to find there are no normal flights crossing east to west in my area except on these days when the sky is full of these trails it’s clear something is up. The airport can’t tell me where these plane are coming from or going. I asked.
I also watch as these trails spread out to eventually create a huge cirrus cloud, true contrails never make clouds.
You can’t tell if a contrail is above or below a thin layer of clouds because the clouds do not darken the contrail or vice-versa. All you have where they cross is white plus white, so it would look identical above or below (obviously smaller if above). It’s an optical illusion, and deserves a post sometime, as I’ve explained it several times already.
Planes do not always fly on the regular schedules you mention. UPS planes for example have no real fixed schedule. Private jets have no schedule at all and are essentially random. Scheduled flights do have a schedule, but it’s not always the same every day, and they are frequently subject to delays of up to several hours.
East-West flights in SW FL does not sound like passenger flights. More likely military, possibly training flights.
True contrails do sometime spread out and make layers of clouds. Where did you read otherwise?
Here’s the previous explanation I gave of above/below thin clouds, slightly different way of putting it that might help.
If you really think there is no such thing as chemtrails watch this video showing documentation that the government has wanted to use chemtrails for “good”.
I guess I can’t post a youtube video link here. Typical.
Uncinus: Do you work for the government in any way?
And here’s a visual
[img]https://contrailscience.com/skitch/clouds-stipple-transparent.gif_%40_100__%28Layer_3%2C_RGB_8%29_%2A-20110204-110546.png[/img]
Clouds are made up of trillions of little drops of ice or water. Here those are drawn as individual white dots on the image. There is space between the white dots and the blue sky behind them.
The white line representing a contrail is then drawn either in front of the clouds, or behind the clouds. In both cases it looks [i]exactly[/i] the same. In both cases it looks like it is in front. It’s an optical illusion.
I’ll put this in a post eventually, for easy reference.
Thanks Todd, yes he seems a bit out there, he says he is getting nothing out of it and that there just needs to be truth, blah blah. Interesting stuff about Scaler weapons though, it was a new one for me. I did learn about the photo’s here but I don’t know that he is the one perpetuating them.
Umm, Facts’ , where to start with you..You have more issues than a paper stand. Manners would be a good place I think….
You have so much advice for me and I was clarifying that Science is not primarily driven by EVIDENCE, in response to someone else’s comment, I said: “Science does not always use evidence”. It’s a true, fair statement and an opinion for which there is plenty of evidence to back it up, as you seem to be so unnerved by my comments perhaps it is you that needs to do the research for your own peace of mind. I know what I am talking about so I don’t need to continue a song and dance but don’t let me stop you, it’s not why I came here. I came in fact to share my “Comments” because for some strange reason this website invites, comment, speculation, theory, BS, “opinion” and belief as well as and good old fashioned HOT AIR (that’s where you come in).
“If you can provide me with examples that indicate that the “majority” of science is BS,”
If you can provide evidence that I stated that, go for your life. I didn’t and I guess I can see why you are on your high horse if that’s what you are getting out of my posts. Frankly I’m not big on repeating myself and I love a good debate which is why I’m leaving this one, all other company excluded of course ^_^.
This time I’m off to bed
Cheers’
JAX
Uncinus: I took the picture. The plane was way below the clouds. Don’t believe me? Oh well!
Here’s a more detailed image showing the layer arrangement and a red line. The red line can be discerned as being above or below, but the white line cannot.
[img]https://contrailscience.com/skitch/Photoshop-20110204-111414.png[/img]
How exactly do you know it was below the clouds. It just LOOKED LIKE it was. It’s an optical illusion, as I demonstrate above.
Uncinus: Believe what you will. The plane was low enough to see. The chemtrail is very detailed. Zoom the pic to see. But as I see you have been defending your opinions here for a couple of years I doubt anything will ever change your mind. Altho I have a feeling you know the chemtrails are real and it’s your job to poo-poo any discussion concerning them.
Okay, I zoomed in all the way. If it was low enough to see then why can’t it be seen in the photo?
[img]https://contrailscience.com/skitch/IMAG0105.jpg_%283264%C3%971952%29-20110204-113823.jpg[/img]
Both the pics I posted are the same plane. The one with the solid trail was taken 30 seconds before the one with the broken trail. Just put the solid one to the right and paste them together. You’ll see the trail shouldn’t be different within 30 seconds. If the weather is causing the trail, why is it a different trail within 30 seconds? Same plane, same altitude, same weather.
The plane had travel 30 seconds from the time it made the broken trail. In that time it was 5 miles farther away.
Todd-
why is there a cloud in one spot but not another? Same sky, same altitude, same weather…
It does not seem like you are legitimately researching the known behavior of contrails- instead clinging to your misconceptions despite of evidence to the contrary.
Uncinus showed you a picture of a contrails from 35years ago that was IDENTICAL to the one you posted…doesn’t that make you consider the possibility that you might be wrong?
What do you make of this explanation to why the trail looked the way it did?:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crow_Instability
The reason the trail
Todd-
why is there a cloud in one spot but not another? Same sky, same altitude, same weather…
It does not seem like you are legitimately researching the known behavior of contrails- instead clinging to your misconceptions despite of evidence to the contrary.
Uncinus showed you a picture of a contrails from 35years ago that was IDENTICAL to the one you posted…doesn’t that make you consider the possibility that you might be wrong?
What do you make of this explanation to why the trail looked the way it did?:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crow_Instability
sorry for the double post..user error 🙂
SR1419:
The day I took those pictures I was at Lido Beach in Sarasota, Florida. Here is a picture of the beach. As I saw the plane I noticed it was just starting to spit out what looked like smoke. until it became a solid line. I took a picture of the plane and then 30 seconds later took the pic of the broken trail. I have one other trail pic I may post later. To the south, where the plane came from, there was some light clouds forming. To the north, where the plane was in the solid line pic, the sky was clear. Remember, the sun was in the south-eastern sky, so the north facing pic was a deeper blue. These pictures are dated by the computer in the camera/phone
[img]https://contrailscience.com/wp-content/uploads/IMAG0107.jpg[/img]
Todd-
I am unclear as to what your point is…can you clarify.
You neglected to address any of my points-
Clearly- contrail behavior such as you photographed has been observed for decades…
You commented that the trail shouldn’t behave differently in one part of the sky versus another…and I pointed out that clouds do that all the time…thats why there are sometimes clouds in one spot but not another as the conditions in the atmosphere can change from spot to spot…
The main variables that dictate contrail behavior are temp and humidity…changing either one even slightly can change the behavior of the trail…
“Uncinus: Do you work for the government in any way?”
Is there ANYONE here that didn’t expect that?!
Like one has to “work for the government” to understand and spread information on how water vapor reacts in any given situation. Hilarious!
“Umm, Facts’ , where to start with you..You have more issues than a paper stand. Manners would be a good place I think…. ”
Your manners leave much to be desired. Accusing people of wrongdoing simply because you “believe it” is a ridiculous stance. How DARE you accuse me of having bad manners you hypocrite!
Go ahead, “believe” whatever you want. I’m actually glad you live like that.
And show me ANYTHING that is claimed to be truth in science that doesn’t rely on evidence. Again, more absurdity!~
I’m not unnerved by anything you’ve written…I’m just surprised that you are able to function in society with such a warped world view. I’m entitled to my opinion about you, just as you’re entitled to your opinion about all of science being “completely manipulated”. Honestly, I don’t really care what you want to believe…but you really should learn to use words like “my opinion” and “I believe”. I know you won’t because you have already convinced yourself that your world view is accurate. I was simply pointing out how absurd that is.
No “hot air” here…just asking you to support your beliefs (statements of FACT) with something other than more opinions. I didn’t think you actually would…and I was right.
“If you can provide evidence that I stated that, go for your life. ”
“I was simply stating Science is just another part of the bureaucracy and is completely manipulated …”
Close enough! The term “completely manipulated” certainly suggests that you believe what is presented to us AS science is BS….does it not?! I’d be glad to read your explanation…in fact, I can’t wait!
Please look up the word “paraphrasing”.
SR:
The point I made was the plane was low. I saw it close up.
If I ignored a comment of yours along the line please forgive me.
TF:
If he doesn’t “work fo da man”, why not say so?
It seems to me some people spend a lot of time trying to convince people something doesn’t exist. If it’s not real, why bother arguing it?
Todd –
once again, the pictures you posted are of an ordinary contrail in conditions where it formed but did not persist. It lasted just enough for you to see it breaking while dissipating. I’m sure that in less than five minutes there was left no trace of it.
And again, the earlier picture (that you posted second) proves that it was a two-engine jet flying high enough to be seen on the photo.
Todd-
it doesn’t look low from the pictures…it, in fact, looks very high…
And the trails behave just has contrails always have and so, I see nothing odd…If you look closely you can see some high thin cirrus clouds which would indicate conditions ripe for persistent contrails.
Glad you had a nice day at the beach.
The same guy is posting as different people here I see. Well. I’ll be off, just wanted to drop these pics on the web for search purposes. Have fun Jim.
“chemtrails” are a modern day witch-hunt and nothing more.
That statement is based on science as it’s understood today. Given ANY atmospheric conditions…science easily explains how the vapor will react. There is NO evidence that a single trail has been deposited in conditions that don’t support them. If the air is warm and dry, short lived or no trails at all…if the air is cold and humid, long lasting and spreading trails will result. And in all the conditions in between will be trails of various duration.
How am I the one without manners?! Is asking someone to back up their accusatory statements with facts unreasonable?! I don’t believe so…it’s certainly more unreasonable to accuse others of horrific crimes without a single shred of evidence.
If there is ANY evidence that this is incorrect, I’d GLADLY look at it.
I live in a country where everyone is innocent until PROVEN guilty. I have yet to see anything that shows these planes are “spraying” anything. And accusing the pilots, “the military” and “the government” of harming us in any way with these trails, without any evidence, is disgusting. I’m not riled up…just stating the facts as they are presented to me. All I see so far is a large group of people who pretend they understand simple and basic science and aviation principles…but don’t.
“If he doesn’t “work fo da man”, why not say so?
It seems to me some people spend a lot of time trying to convince people something doesn’t exist. If it’s not real, why bother arguing it?”
Why should he HAVE TO?! And he has, several times…does he have to address that accusation every time some paranoid presents it?!
And I argue this simply because as a former pilot with many friends and family in the aviation business I have a MORAL RESPONSIBILITY to my fellow man to guide him to the facts when he is accusing others (people I happen to care for very much) of wrongdoing based on VERY bad information.
Just as my shortcut for this site is named…”ConScience”…I couldn’t live with myself if I let my fellow man accuse the innocent of wrongdoing…and live like Chicken Little for no reason other than pure ignorance.
This is a hobby for me…I spend MAYBE an hour per day trying to get people to go to the library and learn about atmospheric science instead of accepting paranoid crap they find on the internet as fact. If you can’t understand how noble Uncinus is, I feel very sorry for you! This man is spending HIS time trying to help his fellow man while others insult and accuse him of wrongdoing based on ridiculous nonsense.
Do you REALLY believe that you know more about this subject because you accepted what you read online as fact instead of learning this material form respectable and reliable sources?! Have you contacted a single atmospheric scientist in this matter or do you believe they are all in on it and won’t be honest?!
Again, the way water vapor (from the combustion of hydrocarbons) reacts within ANY given atmospheric conditions is well understood. Can you provide a single instance where a trail was created where it shouldn’t have been? If so, please provide the details. That’s all we are asking for here! People are making a claim…and those of us who don’t believe “chemtrails” to be real are asking for evidence. How does THAT translate to “working for the government”?! If you can’t see how odd that is…I can’t help ya!
It is kind of sad really.
Uncinus has said many times on this site that he does not work for the Govt – some just dont’ want o bother readin I guss.
However I do work for “the Govt” – albeit the Govt I work for is not in the Americas, or Europe, and is not part of NATO. What’s more I work for the national aviation authority of the Govt – the equivalent of the FAA in the USA.
I’m not sure what that means to peole who believe in the NWO or whatever.
But as a civil servant my job is to report and interpret facts to the Minister, and to anyone else who cares to ask. I have answered or provided answers to a couple of official questions along the lines of “What is this aircraft spraying?” – and the answer is that it is “spraying” the products of combustion of hydrocarbons, plus minuscule amounts of particulates generated by wear and tear inside the engine – typically alloys of steel, titanium, bronze, rubber, plastic, magnesium, or whatever else parts that are rubbing together are made of.
IIRC when the answers were reported back in the chattering blogosphere it was along the lines of “just the usual fob-off” – which as far as I’m concerned now is just the usual expression of ignorance and unwillingness to examine verifiable evidence instead of accepting sensationalist speculatoin.
But hey – that’s just me – I’m clearly an agent of the NWO :/
Todd – you post a picture at #810, and then later say the plane was low enough to see.
The picture and your statement are incompatible with each other – the plane cannot be seen in the picture.
“…and the answer is that it is “spraying” the products of combustion of hydrocarbons, plus minuscule amounts of particulates generated by wear and tear inside the engine – typically alloys of steel, titanium, bronze, rubber, plastic, magnesium, or whatever else parts that are rubbing together are made of.”
As with all engines…and anything else that is introduced to friction. If I rub sandpaper across my aluminum keyboard, I’ll create tiny particles of aluminum and silicon carbide. As I walk down the street and scuff my boots from time to time I’m leaving particles of rubber and pavement here and there. And when I kick up some sand with those boots, I’m creating an aerosol.
“But hey – that’s just me – I’m clearly an agent of the NWO :/”
You and me both, brother!
LOL!
Todd; Uncinus has stated many times on this site that he does not work for “the government.” There are a least a dozen places he’s posted that information, and I haven’t even read everything on this site yet. perhaps if you spent more time reading before posting you’d get more out of it.
As a fellow disinfo shill working for the New World Order, I am wondering where my pay check is? I’m also wondering how I’m supposed to serve the dark lizard lords with this 5 year-old computer? Not only that, I am running out of food, the rent is due, and I have a sinus infection but no health insurance.
The “New World Order” was originally a wet dream of the John Birch Society and Lyndon (I’M NOT CRAZY!) LaRouche. I have no idea why more people aren’t aware of that, or worse, don’t care.
Apologies for the sarcasm.
Todd says, “I can see low flying planes leaving chemtrails that are clearly not contrails. This picture I’m uploading shows the trail broken in several places. Contrails don’t look like this ever!”
But Todd, contrails do often look exactly like that. Please check out the following sections ~
Contrail Gaps and other questions
Broken Contrails
I believed there was some really weird stuff going on in the sky too a while back, OK? I’ve still got thousands of pictures I took of “suspicious contrails” over Seattle in 2007, and there is not a single one of those pictures that is a mystery to me today. Unfortunately, I got pulled into a lot of genuine disinfo sites before I started finding sites based on scientific fact.
I know you’re not going to believe a word I’m saying. But please just check out some more info on this site? After all, that can’t hurt, right?
I’ve added this to the “About” page
I’m not paid for this. I do not work for anyone in conjunction with this site. I’m just some guy.
The Facts,
Wow, you are still going….. feel free step off the soap box and let the other voices have their “opinion”, Lord knows we have heard yours over and over ..and over.
“If you can provide evidence that I stated that, go for your life. ”
“I was simply stating Science is just another part of the bureaucracy and is completely manipulated …”
Close enough! The term “completely manipulated” certainly suggests that you believe what is presented to us AS science is BS….does it not?! I’d be glad to read your explanation…in fact, I can’t wait!
Soooo, you couldn’t actually find that quote which you misquoted me on…strange, it’s almost as though it was not there and you are on an emotional rant and I didn’t state that at all…Oh yes, “Close enough!” was your best effort. Interesting as your OPINION about what you DECIDED I was discussing was actually NOT what I was saying OR stating at all. Last time I checked the term “completely manipulated” did equal “BS” but it seems close enough is good enough for you, and you wonder why I don’t pander to your cries for “evidence” of what i have stated over and over is my educated opinion. If you truly believe Science as a whole is driven by Scientific Endeavor then I just feel a bit sorry for you. I wonder how you survive out there with such a naive view of the world, if only it were like that.
I guess I find it difficult to relate to a person who comes into this type of environment using the name “I’m right and that’s final”. Excuse me if I misquoted your name, it’s apparently the done thing according to some.
By the way “completeley manipulated” does not necessarily mean science is invalid or as YOU say “BS” I am only stating (get ready, I have said it before but I’ll try and say it slowly this time):
“There are many egos involved in scientific fields as well as other drivers such as money and power.”
If you “can’t wait” for my replies, I’d day that’s a sure sign it’s time to get out and about more cause I’m really bored of your knee jerk responses, really get over yourself mate we are all allowed to have a view even if it’s as Narcissistic as yours.
Ciao now brown Cow.
I don’t think these 2 statements are compatible??
“Last time I checked the term “completely manipulated” did equal “BS” …”
and
“By the way “completeley manipulated” does not necessarily mean science is invalid or as YOU say “BS”…”
BTW New Scientist recently noted that scientists are well aware that all sorts of things get in the way of perfect objectivity & anyone claiming such is almost always leapt upon simply for daring to say so!
tl dr
Completely = 100%
completely
adverb totally, entirely, wholly, utterly, quite, perfectly, fully, solidly, absolutely, altogether, thoroughly, in full, every inch, en masse, heart and soul, a hundred per cent, one hundred per cent, from beginning to end, down to the ground, root and branch, in toto (Latin), from A to Z, hook, line and sinker, lock, stock and barrel.
Manipulated = turned into BS
ma·nip·u·late (m-npy-lt)
tr.v. ma·nip·u·lat·ed, ma·nip·u·lat·ing, ma·nip·u·lates
1. To move, arrange, operate, or control by the hands or by mechanical means, especially in a skillful manner: She manipulated the lights to get just the effect she wanted.
2. To influence or manage shrewdly or deviously: He manipulated public opinion in his favor.
3. To tamper with or falsify for personal gain: tried to manipulate stock prices.
4. Medicine To handle and move in an examination or for therapeutic purposes: manipulate a joint; manipulate the position of a fetus during delivery.
“completely manipulated” = 100% tampered with and falsified for personal (the scientists) gain = 100% of science is BS. Meaning ALL (completely) of science is falsified (BS).
As stated before, I was paraphrasing. It’s obvious what you meant.
Look Jax, I have already EASILY shown you to be unreasonable. I see no reason to continue discussing this matter with you because it will be a waste of my time. Go ahead and confuse opinion and fact all you want..no skin off my nose!
I’m perfectly satisfied showing that your world view is a mess. I win!
“what i have stated over and over is my educated opinion. ”
LOL!!!!
Let’s go back a bit….
You wrote in post #804
“I was simply stating Science is just another part of the bureaucracy and is completely manipulated and controlled for a bunch of reasons that have little to do with science.”
Let’s break this down….
You wrote that you are “stating” that science (all of science, or you would have specified) is part of the bureaucracy AND is completely (100%) manipulated (falsified, turned into BS).
Have you looked up the word “paraphrasing” yet?! LOL!!!
That is a statement of FACT, not opinion. If it were opinion, it would have been preceded with the words, “in my opinion”. It wasn’t. I called you on that particular statement (in post 805) with “I think you need to learn to use words like “in my opinion….” and “it’s my belief that….”. ” and no matter how hard you try now, you can’t take your statement of fact back, and that frustrates you. I love it! It’s all there is black and white yet now you continue to “try” to deny it. It really doesn’t get any better than this. Thanks.
FactsMatter….if you want to convince someone that there might be an err in their thinking, backing them into a corner leaves them no way out on their own.
And for someone to change their mind…it is just that — they must change “their own” mind.
…pounding an idea in, usually only results in a more defensive (protective) closing of the mind.
I’m not trying to “convince” him/her of anything. I’m not actually trying to convince anyone of anything on this site! I’m simply asking that these people provide evidence to support their disgusting and perverted accusations. I’m not here to teach people! I’m here to mock them for being paranoid liars about people I happen to care about. I wouldn’t even BEGIN to believe I can change the mind of a single one of these lunatics! Nor do I WANT to! I’m glad they live as they do! They deserve it!
The person made an accusatory statement of fact and I was simply posting the information necessary for this person to see the mistake he/she made. Not that I believe he/she is actually capable.
This person’s mind is already closed to any and all rational thinking. Please stop pretending that if I didn’t confront this person that there was a chance that he/she would have come around to normal thought processes on his/her own!
Also, I can’t stand rude hypocrites who call others out about their behavior and then exhibit the same. Which brings me to my next point…don’t YOU sometimes like to push some CT buttons?! If you’d like, I’d be willing to quote some examples of not-so-friendly comments of your own.
I’ll try to keep myself more in check as not to offend you….
LOL!!!
*cough*
https://contrailscience.com/politeness-policy/
Yeah, those two are quite rude. Thanks for pointing it out to them…again. Some people just don’t get it!
😉
Howdy Jax. You bring up the work of A.C. Griffith? I don’t know why he says the things he does, but concerning his government/military history, my research shows A.C. Griffith was an Airman 2nd Class in 1959, and served with the 6925th Radio Squadron, Mobile, as a radio repairman ~ http://www.chemtrailcentral.com/forum/thread5946-30.html ~ I think that’s great, but I’m not sure why I should believe his supposed NSA and CIA connections. I thought he was running a little radio repair shop in Nevada until he retired a few years ago? That’s what my background check on the guy turned up anyway.
But HAARP, scalar weapons, the kitchen sink, are not contrail-related.
“It seems to me some people spend a lot of time trying to convince people something doesn’t exist. If it’s not real, why bother arguing it?”
That’s a better use of time than those who are trying to convince people that something that doesn’t exists exists.
I wonder why the believers have never put upthis a/c as an example – it ticks all the boxes – commercial, dropping stuff at altitudes lower than contrails would form……..http://www.10tanker.com/
[img]https://contrailscience.com/wp-content/uploads/home_image-1.jpg[/img]
[img]https://contrailscience.com/wp-content/uploads/home_image2.jpg[/img]
Here’s a couple of YT videos – teh first is from our old friend “tanker enemy” identifying a suspecious looking aircraft and harrassing an airport employee who has no idea what’s flying around by way of “proof”:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tjUsYrPNhIU
The next is the same aircraft at Nellis a/f base on return from loan to the Italian AF:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nI3xoAlh87M
apparently this secret chemtrail sprayer was so hush hush that the Italian public were allowed to lok through it but they hid the chemtrail switches – http://www.airliners.net/search/photo.search?regsearch=N606TW&distinct_entry=true
courtesy of “Tommyjo” over at ATS – http://www.abovetopsecret.com/forum/thread663493/pg3#pid10584613
Oh please!! This site is clearly a cover-up site.. Baaaaaaahhhh Baaaaaahhhhhhh Baaaaaahhhhhhh
Explain why I see CHEMtrails cris-cross the skies every clear day!Oh Nasa admits, the earth IS darker since the government has been spraying. Didn’t the Obama administration admit they were spraying the atmosphere to battle global warming??????? (global carbon taxes for everyone yipeeeeeeee!!!)
No. But scientists have suggested doing this for several decades if global warming were to get to too big a problem. There’s no evidence anyone has ever attempted this.
What you see are probably just persistent contrails.
Global dimming is due mostly to industrial emissions. Aviation is a pretty small factor in that. See:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Global_dimming
And it’s actually been brightening up since 1990.
“Explain why I see CHEMtrails cris-cross the skies every clear day!”
Because you mistake contrails for somethitgn more sinister that hasn’t been shown to actualy exist.
there’s a vast amount of information – actual, real, scientific, verifiable fact – referenced on this site that shows this to be the case, and nothing of the sort anywhere that shows otherwise.
I hope that helps.
@Mike H; GEEZ…dude…I thought that “baa baa baa you’re a sheep” was stupid when I was one of y’all, and I still do. If there are any people behaving like a herd of placid animals, it is people who cannot learn from science.
Was that too strong? Sorry…had a bit of a hard day. Wouldn’t hurt to read this site, “Mike H”, because after all, if you are right, then there is nothing here that will change your mind, right? You know, “know your enemy” and stuff. So please, READ.
Even if chemtrails don’t exist, in the manner you are describing, all of you debunkers… Why does America have 60 year old weather modification companies (way more than any other country) who provide Silver Iodide cloud seeding services (which is the only service I’ll focus on here)? Many people have found no use for these companies for actually modifiying the weather, citing that were ineffective. How do these companies stay in business with a product that apparently sucks? Silver iodide has been accumulating for years and years in our soil and water. The CDC hoped to lower these levels in the 80’s by reducing the number of weather modification allowed to be performed. That never came to pass. Here’s what some crazy conspiracy theorists had to say about this particular substance:
The Office of Environment, Health and Safety, UC Berkeley, rates silver iodide as a Class C, non-soluble, inorganic, hazardous chemical that pollutes water and soil.(8) It has been found to be highly toxic to fish, livestock and humans.(6,7,8,9) Numerous medical articles demonstrate that humans absorb silver iodide through the lungs, nose, skin, and GI tract.(7,8,9) Mild toxicity can cause GI irritation, renal and pulmonary lesions, and mild argyria (blue or black discoloration of the skin). Severe toxicity can result in hemorrhagic gastroenteritis, shock, enlarged heart, severe argyria, and death by respiratory depression.(8)
It’s apparent that our government has our health as a priority (sarcasm). Oh and don’t worry, you don’t have to pay for these services, other people will. “In the past, a Texas rancher was able to stop cloud seeding over private land, based on trespassing and nuisance law.”
Oh but wait, don’t worry if you’re one of those people who don’t like to see clouds during the day over your city (one of their touted services), and you’re just not prepared for a lawsuit. North American Weather Consultants also offers special “consequential effects” insurance coverage for any project, if desired! http://www.nawcinc.com/NAWCflyer.pdf.
Have fun convincing yourselves the government cares about you or your family’s health.
“No. But scientists have suggested doing this for several decades if global warming were to get to too big a problem. There’s no evidence anyone has ever attempted this.”
Is this really just a site for you to spread lies and misinformation?
Read this, and please take down this ridiculous website.
http://coto2.wordpress.com/2010/07/28/case-orange-60-years-of-geoengineering-goes-into-hyperdrive-as-%E2%80%98plan-b%E2%80%99/
You cite that wordpress article like it’s the truth. WordPress is like Wikipedia- anyone can write anything they want. It’s the same as this site. There’s nothing that intrisicly (sp?) supports the validity of this site any more than any other site- besides our own assertions.
That review of the Case Orange report referred to in post 871 is pretty shoddy.
The Case Orange report was never all that good to start with. There is a lot of palagerised material there, and much of the original text is non sequitur.
Unlike Wikipedia, it can’t be locked down by the government to have their spin of “true facts” to be solidified in the Wikipedia archives. It is just a recap of information that one person was able to locate based off of a real report with real documented facts. Beleive it or not, we used to be able to think for ourselves. Did you even read my previous post? Jesus christ, just google weather modification services and take your pick.. I just chose to pick on North American Weather Consultants.
I could care less about plagerism. If even ONE of those 32 documented points are the truth, which it’s plainly evident that most of it is, then all bets are off. Being that the government will claim that EVERYTHING is a matter of security means they have full reign on what the mindless masses will be told to believe (and apparently can use biological warfare against it’s citizens in a breach of national security – just as our forefathers intended right?).
Speaking of forefathers, you should search youtube for “Operation Trojan Horse Forefather Warnings”, we lost this battle long ago.
Weather modification services are cloud seeding – as you would know if you bothered to actually read any of those googled links! Cloud seeding ahs been going on for decades, and is not done by airliners at 30,0000 feet on normal passenger services.
Why you chemtrail hoaxers keep bringing it up when it’s so patently nothing to do with your unfortunate fantasy?
Derr, I thing we get that you think that the government is evil, and would have no problem poisoning people for decades.
But even if we assume the government is actually currently poisoning us on a large scale, where the actual evidence that it’s done via contrails?
Are contrails any different to how they were in the past?
Has there been analysis of the contrails that shows them containing toxins?
As far as I know, the answer to both those questions is no. I’d be happy to hear actual evidence to the contrary, if you have it.
http://www.ranches.org/cloudSeedingHarmful.htm, looks pretty bad to me. It’s almost as if no one is reading here. Doesn’t surprise me.
http://www.rense.com/general69/chemd.htm (I know it’s Resne, but the article has valid information)
Also,
Case Orange also reveals a 1991 patent held by Hughes Aircraft Company [15] that:
“contains 18 claims to reduce global warming through stratospheric seeding with aluminum oxide… thorium oxide … and refractory Welsbach material ….”
(from my link earlier)
My point is not that we’re dying on large scales because of this crap, but that they are allowed to spray it, and lie to you poor saps about it..
Whether the chicals used in cloud seeding are bad or not is pretty much irrelevant to the chemtrail hoax though – it says that commercial airliners on passenger services are being used to spray us with various substances designed to eitehr reduce global population, or fight global warming, or improve the earthquake generating effects of HAARP or some othe conspiracy – pick which ever one you like.
Cloudseeding is simply not a part of it.
I would no more want to ingest a lungfull of silver iodide (or anything else used for cloudseeding) than I would want to ingest a lungful of jet exhaust.
But cloud seeding is not chemtrails…..nothing else is eithe of course, but cloud seeding is ESPECIALLY not contrails! 🙂
Oh and if we are really “dying on a large scale from this crap” how come no-one can measure what the crap is? And populations are actually still increasing worldwide?
I hear the US life expectancy has decreased by 1/10th of a year recently……but the US isn’t the only place where this is going on and that decrease hasn’t happened anywhere else – we’re still getting older over here!
As a population control measure it is a singular failure!!
So where’s the evidence that connects it to contrails?
Mike, you seem a bit confused. I was saying I don’t beleive that it is killing people on a large scale, but the mentioned adverse effects of all the chemicals mentioned above (not just Silver Iodide, and sure, take a large breath of it, induce toxicity – novel idea) to the environment and humans is jut a bit intrusive on our lives.
The one link I provided blatantly shows that they have some of these programs to combat Global Warming, I never said that wasn’t the case.
I prefer to tackle one issue at a time.
Here’s something we can all believe in:
Contrail, Chemtrail, Cloud Seeding (apparently not in either of the other categories), Shittrails, whatever you want to call it, voluntary relinquishing of rights, Fluoride in the water, calcified perinial glands of children, Rothschilds, MI6, CIA/MI5, never ending wars, media control, free energy stolen (Tesla), fat cats, wageslave, democracy/federal banking systems (in every UN nation), mechanism for control, self appointed meritocracy, scientifically ran governments, vaccines, 1984, Muslims fighting for their heritage and lives, all of which are American dreams.
Sorry had to go out with a bang. It’s been a pleasure. Praise hail Satan (to further discredit myself – my gift to you Uncinus).
“calcified perinial glands of children” should read “calcified pineal glands of children”
Fun stuff.
If you don’t believe tehy are killing us in large nubmers tehn why mention it at all – sorry – to me it looked like “they are killing us in large numbers but that’s not actually my main point”……which was just weird…..
Not sure what you are expecting agreement about with the rest.
My point is that I cannot provide any more blatant evidence for my positions on the contrail/chemtrail/weather modification subject.
The last bit is just something you can google and find nothing but atrocities to keep you up at night. Speaking of nightmares I forgot about Tavistock Institute. “1948 – Declaration of Israel as an independent state” (that’s a quote from their ‘History’ page on their website). Just google them, it’s quite an organization!
There’s lots of evidence that people have been talking about geoengineering and climate modification for decades. That’s what you link to.
There is ZERO evidence that anyone is actually spraying anything as part of such a program. That’s what you don’t have.
Localized weather modification is not a secret, does not look like “chemtrails”, and it’s not climate modification. That’s where the “case orange” report conflates the facts.
Origin of the name “case orange”?
http://en.battlestarwiki.org/wiki/Case_Orange
Your pointless references fall on deaf ears (with good reason). The very point of this article is to say that “some people feel they must be part of a decades long conspiracy to spray stuff into the atmosphere to alter the weather or reduce the population. That’s obviously nonsense, but what are these strange planes?”
So.. did I just see you say that “There’s lots of evidence that people have been talking about geoengineering and climate modification for decades.”? If you actually look at that “chatter” on the link I provided it is government officials discussing these matters and proof of 3rd party contractors’ patents for spraying aluminum oxide to control the weather.
And of course I don’t have any “physical evidence” or whatever you require before you let go of this ideal that the information you provide on this site has any value. I don’t have access to run real tests that cannot be skewed or isolated to areas where spraying is not frequent. The point is, they are spraying toxic things in the atmosphere, be it harmful to us our not, and lying about it in public forums. I have proof of that through documentation, plenty of it. But instead you’d rather go searching for battlestarwiki articles, which have no bearing on the subject. You are doing such a great service to humanity. Keep up the misinformation and discrediting of scientific findings.
Quote a lie from a public forum.
“Quote a lie from a public forum.”
Quote from someone with no valid rebuttal.
I’ve done my research. Look at the links I provided… Dig down to the SOURCE (which all of them provide), governmental/scientific documents, articles, written in plain English that spells it out for you.
It’s plainly evident you either are incapable of thinking for yourself or this is a government ran website. In either case, you are a waste upon mine and anyone else’s lives who come across this website.
Speaking of government ran websites.. Gotta love whois privacy.. Nothing shady about hiding whois information for a civilian owned/non-commercial website.
Point out the absence of evidence is a very valid rebuttal to a claim.
You said:
Now, your first point is overly broad, as you include crop spraying and cloud seeding, which is are not part of the general chemtrail theory (if they were, then it’s hardly some contentious theory, as both those things are common knowledge that nobody denies).
The claim I was asking about is the “lying about it in public forums”. You claim you have proof of lies. So quote a lie.
It’s actually very common. People don’t want to put their home address and phone number up on the internet.
But I’ve got nothing to hide. You can find my real name very easily. I’m just some guy.
I should probably write a full post sometime, debunking Case Orange. After all they (anonymously) were nice enough to reference me several times, and used a photo I took from my balcony. But let’s just look at one thing:
Patents do not indicate evidence of use. There are literally millions of patents for things that were never built or used.
The previously classified documents seem to just be regarding the use of cloud seeding to make rain in wartime.
The “order forms for Barium” seem to be missing.
The “maps with daily spraying schemes” are described in more detail:
Now that’s funny. And sad. Kevin Martin is an enthusiastic young amateur meteorologist with ambitions to be a TV weatherman.
http://www.southerncaliforniaweatherauthority.com/audition.html
He created the “Chemtrail Alert System” simply to demonstrate he could forecast the formation of persistent contrails. He eventually stopped doing this, and posted an explanation, unfortunately I can’t find it. But on the last archived version of the page it says:
http://replay.waybackmachine.org/20081219041545/http://www.owsweather.com/contrailreport.html
He does not think it’s deliberate. His maps are not “intended spraying schemes”, they are just weather forecasts.
“You claim you have proof of lies. So quote a lie.”
Sorry, I didn’t catch that… looked pretty condescending to me. But here’s a nice little example for you:
”
Just ONE of many. I’m not going to sit here and find every example for someone who could care less.
You seem to be missing the point that you’ve got wording on this article (and website) that suggests everything you see in the sky can be explained as contrails and that it is ridiculous to think otherwise. I am not doubting that contrails are real, I see them all the time. I know they are harmless. But the main issue is that there is more going on than just contrails, which the public has not been aware of and it IS a threat to our liberties and rights. If you were to actually read anything I’ve provided you would have plenty of proof.
But go on, tell me that it’s not good enough. That’s your own problem. It will be plenty valid for anyone else who is not already convinced by ignorance.
Kevin Martin, that amateur meteorologist quoted by Case Orange, did claim to believe in Chemtrails a few years ago. Now he does not:
http://www.examiner.com/la-in-los-angeles/chemtrails-do-not-exist-contrails-are-your-answer
Unfortunately his earlier work is being used as a serious reference. He was quoted as “Kevin Martin, a meteorologist working for the Ontario Weather Service in 2008”, which sounds impressive, as Ontario is a huge province of Canada with 13 million people.
Except actually it’s Ontario, California, a city near Los Angeles of 170,000 people. And the OWS is just Kevin Martin’s old personal web site.
Clearly not, as I’ve got a large page explaining all the things that are not contrails:
https://contrailscience.com/things-that-are-not-contrails-or-chemtrails/
So what is there that you can see in the sky that is not a contrail, or something on that page?
Well you’ve done a good job of showing that it’s okay to spray Aluminum and Silver Iodide into our environment without truly understanding the impact. Thank you. I just don’t accept your ideas of persistent contrails. It’s the lies that get to me. If it’s harmless, let us know. You don’t know, so I’m not going to bother listening to “some guy”.
That’s not a quote of a lie. That’s a quote of a characterization of Laird not knowing what happened as being unbelievable. They are basically talking about a secret program during wartime, but using common techniques of cloud seeding to make temporary localized increases in rain, in Vietnam. This is not geoengineering.
Military officials do not always make public full operational details of their campaigns during wartime, especially the ones that are top secret. Big surprise.
Secretary of Defense Melvin Laird said “we have never engaged in that type of activity over Northern Vietnam .” Two years later he said that in fact they had, but he was unaware of the program.
Government officials don’t tell you about the secret stuff. That in itself is zero evidence that they are actually doing some specific act.
I want to come full circle here and hit on my very first comment which no one responded to with any real point.
“Oh but wait, don’t worry if you’re one of those people who don’t like to see clouds during the day over your city (one of their touted services), and you’re just not prepared for a lawsuit. North American Weather Consultants also offers special “consequential effects” insurance coverage for any project, if desired! http://www.nawcinc.com/NAWCflyer.pdf. ”
I did not make this website, it is not a hoax website, it is a REAL website and a REAL company. What are the consequential effects? And why would you need insurance? They don’t mention that on the main page, but this PDF does. Kind of odd.. a little hard to index for search engines too.. I’m done providing blatant accounts of shady activity and seemingly hidden agendas. Figure it out on your own.
I don’t think it’s a good idea to spray potentially harmful things without examining and considering the consequences. That’s why they generally don’t. I don’t think you’ll find anything that is being sprayed for which such consideration has not been made. Silver Iodide in particular is allowed to be sprayed, not because nobody has considered if it’s harmful, but explicitly because the EPA has determined that the amount used is not harmful.
People disagree, but you can say the exact same thing about thousands of other substances.
Do you think that the white lines in the sky are being used for something like this? Or is your point just a more general: “the government is evil, so they must be doing evil things, like maybe spraying”?
Where the evidence of actual and current spraying?
And thank you for admitting the government lies to preserve “National Security”. My work here is done.
You haven’t looked up Tavistock have you? I could care less what a government agency (EPA) says is safe or not. When there’s so much corruption starting from over a century ago, we have no say what reality is or isn’t. I am more interested in 3rd party findings than governmental mandated findings.
We’re not even discussing a government as you know it, or what children are taught growing up (and not taught – it’s disgusting that I had to learn about Tesla myself after getting out of college), we’re discussing a group of people who have positioned themselves in all facets of our country. Again I refer you to the youtube video “operation trojan horse forefather warnings”. JFK’s speech is absolutely chilling and Woodrow Wilson basically admits to having given all power over to a handful of men, regretfully.
“Consequential effects” in insurance are things that happen not as a direct effect during an event, but later, as a consequence of it. Like say you cloud seed, it rains too much, topsoil is disrupted, and weeks later crop yields are reduced. You can’t claim for the immediate loss of topsoil, but you can claim for the consequential loss of revenue from the reduced crop yield.
Typically in insurance a consequential loss would be something like loss of revenue because a business was closed due to a fire.