Chemtrails: The Best Evidence

The Chemtrail theory proposes that some of the persistent white trails we see in the sky behind airplanes are not actually normal contrails, but are either modified contrails, or some kind of different trail entirely. The theory states that the trails contain chemicals that do something, and that there is a huge secret operation to create these trails that has been going on since at least 1999.

I personally don’t believe in this theory. I’m an avid cloud watcher, and a private pilot (only single engine VFR), and the photos and videos of supposed “chemtrails” all look like contrails to me. So I’ve been discussing this on this site, and quite often proponents of the theory come on to join the discussion.

Unfortunately this frequently devolved into me (or other commenters) saying “show me the evidence”, and the chemtrail theorists saying “there’s lots of evidence”. Then no evidence gets presented, or if it does it’s something I addressed months ago.

The problem here for the theorists is that there seems to be no one place that simply lists all this evidence that they claim is out there. Without this central evidence repository, they just bring up the random bits of supposed evidence in a haphazard and counterproductive manner.

So I’ve decided to help, and on this page to arrange as well presented, organized and honest a representation of the best evidence for “chemtrails” that I can muster.

What I’ll do is take each claim, such as “the government has admitted it”, or “persistent trails have been observed in conditions that should not support them”, and I’ll find the five (or so) best examples of evidence for that particular claim. I’ll leave it up as a work in progress – anyone can challenge a particular piece of evidence, and anyone can suggest a new piece in the comments section.

If the evidence is something I’ve looked at before, then I’ll just add a link to the relevant article. If not, then I might add a comment, or maybe write a new article.

I’ll start out with less than five pieces of evidence, to allow suggestions to be quickly added. Also feel free to suggest new categories. My hope is that eventually this will grow to be a definitive collection of the best evidence for the chemtrail theory.

I apologize for the incomplete nature of this list. I hope to refine it as time goes by. Please feel very free to speak up with any suggestions, which should make it into the list within a few hours.

Persistent Trails were not observed before 1998 (date varies)
(Note:  not all theorists agree with this, some simply state things are different)

1. California Skywatch / Rosaline Peterson – Notes on Discovery Show Transcript, page 8, claims a review of outdoor photos says contrails changed in the late 1980s.

2. Many individual accounts of recollecting contrails not persisting.  Details vary.

3. Ideally I’d like a science book or pre 1990 book that says how long contrails last.  Lots of books say they last for hours.  Any counter evidence?

4.

5.

Persistent trails have been observed in conditions that would not support persistent contrails (Specifically RH <70% and/or temperature >-40F)

1. Chemtrail Central’s Trail Research Report

2. WatchTheSky.org Chemtrails captured on NWS Doppler Weather Data

3. Holmestead – How to detect unusual trails

4.

5.

Trails appear in grid patterns

1. William Thomas

2. Educate-Yourself

3.

4.

5.

Unidentified Spray Planes have been photographed

1. I await candidates. First check here and here.

2.

3.

4.

5.

People Get sick after Chemtrail Spraying

1. William Thomas “Emergency Rooms Jammed

2. I think there’s a KTLA video about this, some mountain community?

3.

4.

5.

Chemical Analysis has shown the presence of unexpected chemicals in rain water.

1. KSLA Barium contrails.

2. Arizona Skywatch – Phoenix Air Particulates.

3. Clifford Carnicom – Barium, etc. Confirmed in rainwater.

4. What in the World are they Spraying

5.

The government has admitted spraying/bioweapon testing/geoengineering/weather modification.

1. Welsbach patent

2. British bioweapon tests

3. Owning the Weather in 2025

4. AP: Obama looks at climate engineering (Alex Jones likes this story)

5. Kucinich and HR 2977.

People don’t remember persistent contrails

1. There’s several individual claims of this, but also several claims to the contrary. Awaiting some kind of study, or even a poll. But I’ll post pretty much any link you think is good evidence of this.

2.

3.

4.

5.

The sky is a different color now

1. See above.

2.

3.

4.

5.

There are open plans to spray aerosols into the atmosphere to mitigate global warming.

1.

2.

3.

4.

5.

The government are doing similar things, and have done before, so why not this?

1. HAARP

2. I’m a little reluctant to include this category, but since it’s brought up, I might as well.

3. Fake Moon Landings (yeah yeah, it belittles your cause, I’ll remove it if you think so, speak up, either way).

4.

5.

I am very willing to add, remove, reorder, or edit the above, based on any suggestions in the comments section below.

843 comments on “Chemtrails: The Best Evidence”

  1. my vids will show how this satellite image is like 1% of the story.
    Brutal day. Whiteout by afternoon and into the night.
    and yes, this is happening ALOT more.
    changing earth? changing universe?
    Geo-engineering experimental options based on that knowledge?

  2. It was indeed a very overcast day. I think quite a lot of it came from contrails. Hard to say how much exactly though. I took this at 12:20 today

    It was though, a rather unusual day. It’s very rare to see such a profusion of contrails. Maybe 2-3 times a year. As it has always been.

  3. BULLSHIT!!!
    Thats why you’re a LIAR! happens very frequently!!!
    this happens all the time!
    thats what all the fuss is about!
    surely you dont think people wouldnt get
    all paranoid about the possible effects/cause of this is
    …despite what people “believe of the cause” of the trails are, if this happened in LA maybe 2-3 times a year!!!
    bullshit! flat out False.

    My video will show the REAL way a spray-day goes down.
    white sky, no blue, period. by afternoon til past dark.
    Your photo looks like the FIRST photo the second i stepped out of the house.

  4. The photo was early in the day. Later it became overcast, in part I’m sure due to the contrails.

    This has always been the case. On some days of the year.

    Now, let’s get down to the nitty-gritty. Exactly how often is “all the time”???

    Because I don’t remember a day like this recently. When was the last day like this? Can you document more than 3 days like this in the last year? What were those days? (and remember we can check the satellite record)

  5. shit its happened more than 5 times this year already, maybe 10, 15, I cant keep track sometimes. way too much data.
    hundreds of photos for 4 years or so.

  6. So document it. How do you expect people to believe you if you can’t provide something as simple as as a list of the days on which “it” happened?

    What were the dates of those days?

  7. and 100% of ALL ‘clouds’ over me today were contrail cirrus.
    100%

    I’d quibble with the 100%. Bu either way – so what? So what if they were?

    The QUESTION here is: is it deliberate?

    If you don’t care if it’s deliberate then I have no argument with you whatsoever.

    If you do think it is deliberate, then explain WHY you think it is.

  8. I’ve never seen a plane get up off the ground and fly around by itself.
    thats why its deliberate silly!
    well…unless it was a drone.

  9. Hey, if I was getting payed to do this Uncinus, sure I’d do a very thorough analysis, research.
    Til then…when i feel like it.

  10. Hey man, “overcast” is like a new england fall/winter. This aint “overcast” its bizzare.

  11. By CTYForg:

    “Hey, if I was getting payed to do this Uncinus, sure I’d do a very thorough analysis, research.”

    This statement proves that YOU ARE FULL OF SHIT!

    If you CARED about knowing the TRUTH, about having FACTS you would “DO A VERY THOROUGH ANALYSIS, RESEARCH” without being paid.

    You just revealed yourself CTYForg, you don’t give a SHIT about getting to the bottom of what’s is REALLY happening, you said it your self, you’d have to be PAID to do a thorough job of researching.

    CTYForg you are a PHONY and a fear monger.

    You PRETEND to be SOOOO open minded, but YOU require MONEY to actually do thorough analysis and research?

    CTYForg, you are a joke.

    (my apologies for the caps, but I’m not positive how to italicize or bold things on this forum)

  12. Suntour, use with <i> inside them to start italics, and </i> inside them to close.
    Use <b> and </b> for starting and closing bold.

    [Admin: edited for clarity]

  13. You PRETEND to be SOOOO open minded, but YOU require MONEY to actually do thorough analysis and research?

    wow Suntour! As if you know me or my life’s work?…you dont! punk ass bitch!
    You dont know how much of my time/energy/money etc i’ve already dedicated
    to political/social/environmental activism.
    I do live in reality, where sustenance and basic needs have to be met.
    In case you’ve never actually been in an Academic or Institutional setting, that IS what “scientists” like those at JPL and CALTECH get paid to do all day. Although they all have their OWN agendas.
    Suntour, you’re a piece of shit. Dont bother talking to me. Where do you live chump?
    Whats a day in the life for Suntour, c’mon! Lets get real. Chicken?

    The fact of the matter is I dedicate an impossible to measure amount of my OWN
    personal resources to issues far more CONCRETE and pressing than this silly debate with folks who
    dont seem to mind the “artificial weather”.

    9/11 is a much bigger issue. But they are ALL inter-related(globalist agendas)
    …just look into the agendas of groups
    like the UN, TRI-LATERAL COMMISSION, COUNCIL ON FOREIGN RELATIONS etc etc etc….

  14. If it’s so “bizarre”, then why have no meteorologists or scientists, or even lay folk, noticed it?

    Actually UNCINUS, dont you think its far MORE bizarre that people know far more about the OSCARS or LADY gaga than the first thing about the history of the FEDERAL RESERVE SYSTEM?
    Thats what is BIZARRE! people are deliberately MIS-informed at all levels.

    Its not really odd for LA people to be completely ignorant of things 2 feet away from them.
    Have you not been in Socal long UNCINUS?

  15. CTYForg

    Don’t pretend to be offended and then start making veiled threats. You’re the one that stated only yesterday “if I was getting payed to do this…I’d do a very thorough analysis, research.” So stop being an obstinate and come to grips with the fact that, by your own admission, you’re not as learned as you could be.

    The science of meteorology, cirrus cloud/contrail formation and jet propulsion have been studied using the scientific method, peer reviewed, published and are indisputable facts. Your constant ignorance and/or overlooking of these key facts tells me that they are the very subjects you haven’t done “very thorough analysis, research” on.

    Now I see why you’re so adamant about your stance, you simply haven’t researched the right information!

    I suggest the following. Head to your local library (it’s free!) and read a book on meteorology, you’ll see that “chemclouds” have been documented for centuries! Also find a book on contrails and read up on contrail formation. Since we have you at the library, you might as well research the differences between high-bypass turbofan engines (new design) and a normal turbojet (old design). Armed with that knowledge, you’ll know exactly where, why and how clouds and contrails form!

    We await the informed, enlightened new you! Good luck, close internet friend!

  16. You’re the one that stated only yesterday “if I was getting payed to do this…I’d do a very thorough analysis, research.” So stop being an obstinate and come to grips with the fact that, by your own admission, you’re not as learned as you could be.

    Sigh.
    Suntour, as someone who understands that occupational specialization is one of the building blocks to
    Hegemonic Empire Status of a Hierarchical society, I am not a proponent, nor a practitioner of it.

    That being said, I believe that I have attained and developed a vast number of skills and intelligences and knowledge
    in my short life…and will continue to do so.
    I often seem to be more knowledgeable than many medical doctors, physicists, politicians, educators etc…
    True Gnosis, is not just about specializing in one Occupational field or Caste.

    Suntour,what I meant to say was that,
    obviously if it was my lifelong field of study (aka my job and the thing you are given the luxury of TIME to study)
    I would have been far more knowledgeable about to meteorology than I am at present.
    – DUH! can we move on?

    No one is ever as knowledgeable as the “could be”. think about it…..Dumbass. 😛
    Seriously, how old are you Suntour?

    Really, man I live in LA and I have an infinite number of libraries at my fingertips on the internet.
    I am very clear about the contrial/cloud formation physics…and I think that there is still a lot to be
    understood about the specifics. Ionization. I’m pretty sure thats one of those things HAARP is testing out.

    Suntour. If you had the sort of frequent whiteout days…and it was a newer phenomenon (something you did not grow up with) then I’m sure you’d understand this is a bigger issue for some than others.
    For me its pretty much PERSISTENT CONTRAIL sky sometimes for days. Certainly many many many times a year.
    So much so that you can look directly out my bedroom window in the morning and see it begin day after day.
    And UNCINUS says that the type of shit that happened yesterday(you’ll see the vid soon) only happens 2 or 3 days a year. That would mean he must have slept or not gone outside at least half the year! shit.
    Nonsense.

  17. CTYForg, I’m 41 and I lived in a flyover state as a kid. I DID grow up with a “pretty much PERSISTENT CONTRAIL sky sometimes for days” which is why I think chemtrailers are so annoying and deluded. Every summer day from the mid 70’s to late 80’s I was outside as much as possible, and I clearly remember the hazy days that would occur when multiple contrails were present. The reason it’s so etched in my mind is, the haze blocked out most of the Sun (a nice respite from the upper 90’s heat), but we didn’t realize that UV rays still made it through the haze and we would always end up sunburned.

    It seemed quite counter intuitive to me as a kid. How do I get burned on an overcast day? That’s when I went to the library and read up on sunburns, which led me to read up on clouds, which led me to discover that persistent contrails can spread and cause hazy skies. Remember, this was back in the early ’80’s.

    Your experience isn’t new, it isn’t unique, you may be enlightened about some things, but contrail formation and behavior is not one of them.

  18. Suntour…..

    I’m 41 and I lived in a flyover state as a kid. I DID grow up with a “pretty much PERSISTENT CONTRAIL sky sometimes for days” which is why I think chemtrailers are so annoying and deluded. Every summer day from the mid 70’s to late 80’s I was outside as much as possible, and I clearly remember the hazy days that would occur when multiple contrails were present. The reason it’s so etched in my mind is, the haze blocked out most of the Sun (a nice respite from the upper 90’s heat), but we didn’t realize that UV rays still made it through the haze and we would always end up sunburned.

    Wait wait wait one minute. I just watched your vids on youtube.
    Currently you live somewhere where it snows and is fairly rural.
    You do not live in Los Angeles proper nor have you ever!
    For you to make claim that PEOPLE LIVING ELSEWHERE THAN YOURSELF have the same weather/contrails
    is ludicrous. Especially that there would be the SAME ‘weather/contrails’ in the early 80’s in LA vs 2010.
    Really reaching there.
    I think you’re more like an internet troll that just wants to talk shit because your life sucks!

    What “flyover state” did you live in be exact. Come on, for science…lets hear it.
    I’ve been to all but one of the States in the US. So lets get down to the nitty gritty.

    I don’t buy your anecdote about PERSISTENT CONTRAIL COVER in SUMMER TIME.
    Its not scientific enough for me, you have no evidence and sounds purely anecdotal from a childs point of view.

    If this was the case for you, how is it that I have lived in the same 5 mile area mainly since the late
    80’s til the present and this sort of WHITE OUT didnt happen in LA, when it was happening in the early 80’s for YOU
    in “some other flyover state”. Doesnt add up. Somethings fishy with your story.

    Personally I just think you dont like people who are environmentalists, among other things.
    I think you live in buttfuck USA, probably the midwest based upon your slight accent, and you dont have
    the foggiest clue what its like to live in Los Angeles.

    You see, Suntour, I’m playing a show/performance at MOCA Los Angeles ( thats the Museum of Contemporary Art)
    This Saturday night and I’m going to be “scaring” a whole new generation of teens (couple thousand of them)
    to think that harmless “persistent contrails” are actually scarey “chemtrails”>!
    Aint there aint a damn the you can do about it. Because you’re a chump in buttfuck USA. Have a good one.

    Why is UNCINUS saying on here over and over again that in LA SUMMER we almost never ever have Persistent Contrails.
    (Which is a total lie by the way. At least until more recently)

    If my girlfriends 2 year old cousin keeps pointing at the sky asking whats that, or another 4 year old asking “what are those lines in the sky” you can bet theres something different going on nowadays.

  19. And SUNTOUR! Please I’m sure theres family photographs from the mid-70’s-80’s of your
    summertime Contrail Haze Barrage!
    Lets see them! Come on!

  20. And SUNTOUR! Please I’m sure theres family photographs from the mid-70’s-80’s of your
    summertime Contrail Haze Barrage!
    Lets see them! Come on!

    First of all, let’s see some of YOUR family photos of clear blue skies over LA. Quid pro quo.

  21. If my girlfriends 2 year old cousin keeps pointing at the sky asking whats that, or another 4 year old asking “what are those lines in the sky” you can bet theres something different going on nowadays.

    Since they have never known anything different, that only illustrates that you find things interesting once you notice them, and that once you begin to find something interesting, then you notice it a lot more.

    Like you, CTYF, you notice contrails a lot more that “regular folk”, don’t you?

    Could this simply be because you are really interested in contrails?

  22. CCTY:

    I often seem to be more knowledgeable than many medical doctors, physicists, politicians, educators etc…

    True Gnosis, is not just about specializing in one Occupational field or Caste.

    obviously if it was my lifelong field of study I would have been far more knowledgeable about meteorology than I am at present – DUH! can we move on?

    I just love that first line…

    And the second…

    And the third…

  23. CTYForg,

    By CTYForg
    “Personally I just think you dont like people who are environmentalists, among other things.”
    “I think you’re more like an internet troll that just wants to talk shit because your life sucks!”
    “Because you’re a chump in buttfuck USA.”

    It’s too bad personal attacks and false arrogance aren’t proof for “chemtrails” because you use both liberally.

    By CTYForg
    “I don’t buy your anecdote…Its not scientific enough for me

    Hmmm, we’re supposed to take your personal anecdotes at face value, but when I use them they’re “not scientific enough”? LMAO, you’re trying to hold personal anecdotes up to scientific scrutiny.

    By CTYForg
    Suntour,what I meant to say was that,
    obviously if it was my lifelong field of study (aka my job and the thing you are given the luxury of TIME to study)
    I would have been far more knowledgeable about to meteorology than I am at present.
    – DUH! can we move on?

    So you admit that you aren’t knowledgeable about meteorology, well that’s a step in the right direction. That explains why you believe that LA is full of “chemclouds”. A degree in meteorology isn’t required, a simple cloud studies book is really all you need.

  24. Suntour, does that have something to do with the maker of the shifts on my Motobocane Grand Touring?

    JazzRoc, are you interested in jazz, rock? like captain beefheart, or king crimson or…..

  25. CTYForg – yes. “Or” many. Rock is the power, jazz the color. Art is life’s bonus, science its truth.

    And I too have anecdotes relating to trails which go back fifty years.

    You’re plain wrong about trails because you don’t understand the atmosphere. A heavy persistent growing trail is a precipitating and falling ice “fountain”, where are gathering many thousands of times more ice crystals than the original seeding exhaust, and which can only be made from almost pure water.

    This is all decipherable from the “Contrails to Cirrus” research paper in “Links”, top left of this page, where scientists have tracked trails using laser equipment both from the ground and from an atmospheric research satellite, quantified all the amounts I have mentioned, and then gone on to demonstrate the manner in which they fell and spread.

    If you free yourself of the loose association you have made between these trails and “other events” you’ll see them for what they are.

    But can you?

  26. LOL Jazzroc.. “Science” is in no way “truth”. Only the truth will set you free.
    you should try out some Taoist or Gnostic philosophy…gets one centered on the only real “truths”.
    One man’s science is another’s “magic”.
    well, I’ll tell you one thing, on the music/sonic art topic, I ‘ll rip you a new one.
    Lets hear your tunes man. Lay it on me. How about some Ruins? Flying Luttenbachers? Yowie? Cheval de Frise?
    You should subscribe to redlinepark.com lots of great stuff, good buddy veterano LA jazzers. Vinny golia, etc….
    my group will have some material there too. And watch my OTHER vids, not the “chemtrail” vids.
    youtube.com/ctyforg

    I’m not “wrong” about anything Jazzroc.
    Tell me why there is a perfect hexagon on the pole of Saturn and we’ll talk.
    You cant. No one can.

  27. Come now, CTYForg, you know perfect well he could tell you, as must have at least done a little research into it and already discovered there are not only reasonable theories based on fluid mechanics and standing waves (in this case a Rossby Wave), but there are demonstrations of how the hexagons could form.

    — Saturn
    — Bucket

    http://arxiv.org/pdf/physics/0511251

    and another theory:

    http://www.tjmitchell.com/stuart/images/johnreid_saturn.jpg

    Are were you making a point about scientific theory in general? Something epistemological?

    The key thing here is the actual evidence. You can theorize all you want, speculate all you want, but you consistently fail to produce any actual evidence that the trails are anything unusual. The only “evidence” you seem to present is your own memory.

  28. CTYForg:

    One man’s science is another’s “magic”.

    That’s actually an interesting point. But it’s not actually as symmetrical as you imply. Non-scientists might think that some science is “magic”, but scientists don’t think that some “magic” is magic. In fact they don’t think anything is magic. It’s all science.

    People are uncomfortable with not understanding things. They like to think they know how things work, so they have a sense of control over the world. Understanding things through science is often hard, and it’s actually a lot easier for people to assign things to “magic” (or more commonly, religion), than it is for them to fully understand via science.

    You might also say about some people that “one man’s science is another man’s conspiracy”. Now I know you are smarter than this, but some people say that ALL persistent contrails are the result of a conspiracy, and they totally reject the decades of science that prove otherwise. They simply choose “conspiracy” because in general it’s their preferred explanation for thing they don’t understand. It’s the fun and easy explanation.

  29. WOW! hey UNCINUS> would you stop being an overgrown dickwad for just one day.
    really. seriously. Try it! you might like it.

    I have posted plenty of evidence from the year of 2010 already.
    And yet all you can say is,”oh but that rarely happens”…despite the EVIDENCE of that NOT being true is right here on your webpage!!

    You say, “oh this happens 2 days a year very rare”…..
    and yet I’ve got the “evidence” of many days already this year already.
    Wtf? Its pointless to bother with you.

    If there are “new” engines which make MORE larger Persistent Contrails how can you claim this ISNT new?
    You said is New!~ so is is New? or not?
    Also, if the new engines are “more efficient” does this mean MORE pollution/particulate? AND more CONTRAILS?
    then fuck THAT! we need to re-define “efficiency” then!
    If the “hydrogen” plane you suggested still produced massive Persistent Trails I think we’d still have the major issue of weather impact.
    Now if you want to talk ONBOARD water to hydrogen cars? hells yeah. We’ve had teh

    You contradict yourself over and over again on this site. It really is pointless.
    You say: “nothings different” when thats clearly, not true.
    Lots has changed. Lots will change.

    when you make statements like: “there are not only reasonable theories based on fluid mechanics and standing waves, but demonstrations of how the hexagons form.”….
    The same can be said about anything else related to aerosols and weathermodz.

  30. Sure UNCINUS, I understand, that you understand, that there are people who just arent that bright.
    right? As long as they arent watching the “oscars” or crap on new 3d tv (i’m told they have this now?)
    then I’m happy.
    The problem at this point isnt with “conspiracy theorists” its with obvious dim-bulbs getting lumped in with those concerned about weather/climite science.

    As mentioned before, “chemtrails” is a broad theory. Nothing concrete enough to really pin down. But enough to know what the possibilities could/will be.
    Your site only helps to shed light on the possible real implications.

  31. CTYForg

    I have posted plenty of evidence from the year of 2010 already.
    And yet all you can say is,”oh but that rarely happens”…despite the EVIDENCE of that NOT being true is right here on your webpage!!

    What I actually said, On march 5th, was

    It was though, a rather unusual day. It’s very rare to see such a profusion of contrails. Maybe 2-3 times a year. As it has always been.

    I was referring to that particular day, and the large amount of clear contrails going in all directions. There are days that have contrails, but not so many. I’m say that a day with contraillyness OF THAT MAGNITUDE is pretty rare, maybe only 2-3 times a year.

    Here’s what it looked like from above:

    Now, how many days can you find like that by going through the entire satellite record for 2009?

    Here’s a handy key I’ve been working on. Lets you see the whole year of LA area mid-day conditions at once:

    http://c.contrailscience.com/thumbs/USA5.2009.terra.key.64.html

    As you can see there are several days when it’s hazy with high cirrus, and several with some contrails. But very few that also show a large number of long contrails like in the above image.

    Note there also a lot of clear days.

  32. If there are “new” engines which make MORE larger Persistent Contrails how can you claim this ISNT new?

    You need to define your terms. What exactly do you mean by “this”?

    Of course contrails have changed. Of course there are now more of them because there are more flights now than there were in 70s and 80s. How could anyone think otherwise?

    What has NOT changed is the fact that some contrails persist and spread.

    You contradict yourself over and over again on this site. It really is pointless.

    If you can quote the contradictions (preferably with links to the pages), then I will fix them. Go ahead.

  33. Uncinus
    Except one is sound an the other is EM. So other than there being waves involve, not related at all.

    Yeah, sound as in ELF. aka HAARP etc… duh? Did you not get the memo?
    And EM as in electromagnetic?
    Thats in there too. SO what the fuck are you smoking? Seems very related to me.
    Extremely related.

    The other test with water was harder to figure out exactly what process was in effect.

  34. As you can see there are several days when it’s hazy with high cirrus, and several with some contrails. But very few that also show a large number of long contrails like in the above image.

    I have a MAJOR problem with your method. It does NOT work that way.
    Your sampling method and visual analysis are EXTREMELY FLAWED!

    What do I mean exactly? The Satellite image of of MARCH 5th that you have
    DOES NOT EVEN BEGIN TO COME CLOSE TO SHOWING WHAT I HAVE ON VIDEO.
    Its as if they are not related at all.
    Your method is so inconsistent! Just looking at a satellite photo from every day “mid-day” wouldnt be accurate….
    The Satellite image you have from MARCH 5th shows some large persistent contrails, but not the countless
    others woven in a web ALL DAY LONG till total WHITEOUT by afternoon.
    MY VIDEOS show this, the satellite doesnt show this.

    How are we to be objective when your system is flawed.
    I have countless photos and videos, while you’re
    taking 1 image a day from a satellite that doesnt even represent/correlate
    with the same INFO as documented by MYSELF!!>>>??

  35. AND, by MY RECORD, of EVIDENCE…

    There are days that have contrails, but not so many. I’m say that a day with contraillyness OF THAT MAGNITUDE is pretty rare, maybe only 2-3 times a year.

    IS COMPLETELY FALSE. Not only that “contrail days arent many” is false. But ALSO that the “magnitude of contraillyness” is only 2 or 3 times a year, is also 100 false. I have the proof.
    And will continue to document the rest of this year.

    sorry.

  36. My sampling method was to take a photo from space at the same time every day for a full 365 days. It’s a perfect statistical sample of contrails at that time of day.

    Your sampling method is to take photos of contrails whenever you see them.

    I’ll be willing to accept some validity to your method when you show you statistics. What are your results so far?

  37. The ELF that HAARP generates is A) not sound waves, B) in the ionosphere (which is practically a vacuum), and C) so weak it’s hard to measure.

    Do you understand the difference between electromagnetic radiation, and sound waves? They are entirely different things.

  38. UNCINUS!!!!!!
    I’m speechless, you’re just as full of shit as “chemtrailers”.
    I thought this website was about “contrails”
    and now you’re trying to explain to me that ELF “is not sound waves”.
    You’re playing games with semantics for no reason.

    HAARP creates ELF by “bouncing”/”focusing” its HF energy back to earth from the Ionosphere.
    If you want to say that its not “sound” waves fine, hey are both terms to describe wavelengths of energy.
    SOUND is energy. It is these different frequencies in wavelength that give any of these ULF VLF ELF its name.
    Same goes for the shit that comes out of your stereo.

  39. There is a vast difference between electromagnetic radiation and sound waves.

    Sound is an oscillation of pressure transmitted through a medium. Humans can hear sound vibrations down to about 12 Hz, you can feel the vibrations of lower frequency notes from subwoofers.

    Electromagnetic radiation requires no medium, it can travel through a vacuum. ELF EM radiation is in the range 3-30 Hz. That’s a type of radio wave.

    Sound is energy, sure. But it’s kinetic energy – it can move things. It’s not radiative energy, which can only heat things up. Saying they are the same thing is semantics. They have entirely different forms and properties. You might as well be saying that cars on the freeway are the same thing as waves in the ocean because they contain energy. They are different things.

  40. What are your results so far?

    My results so far? The the so-called “contraillyness” factor, which you coined, is off the charts if
    your claim is that “heavy contrailyness” only happens in LA 2 or 3 days a year.

    Thats what my results are. I have more than 3 days of “heavy contrailyness” already documented.
    Far more than 3…
    so what is this “normal” you keep referring to?

  41. Not related to the topic, but I found a site with some great shots from ground level of airplanes leaving contrails using a 10″ reflector telescope. If nothing else, it proves that the airplanes leaving contrails certainly aren’t “unmarked”.

    http://www.skystef.be/contrail.htm

  42. CCTYF:

    I’m not “wrong” about anything Jazzroc. Tell me why there is a perfect hexagon on the pole of Saturn and we’ll talk. You can’t. No one can.

    It seems, after all, that you aren’t CORRECT about anything…
    The same reasoning Andrew Johnson presented to me in April of last year. I told him it was obviously a standing wave.
    You can check for yourself in “Andrew Johnson” on the page “Another Waste of Time” at http://jazzroc.wordpress.com
    He challenged: “No evidence to back up your assertions. Please send peer-reviewed reference for the persistence of trails for specifically > 2mins (with named and dated case studies and specific atmospheric measurements at the time).
    When I supplied him with that information he never mentioned it again.
    This is exactly what you have done too. You two should get together and swap comics. He believes that the PTB “swung” the course of a hurricane on the day of 9-11 AND brought down the two towers, using “the Hutchisson effect”.
    You believe you are cleverer than international teams of scientists working with sophisticated instrumentation producing hundreds of science papers on the atmosphere over decades. So does he…

    The answer to this conundrum isn’t too difficult to see, but I’m not spelling it out for you.

  43. Jazzroc

    You’re right, Andrew Johnson et al do believe they’re cleverer than international teams of scientists. That’s just it, they’ve found a ’cause’ and an identity and a career giving ridiculous power point presentations to groups of gullible British nationalists. They DO NOT WANT TO HEAR anything that contradicts their hypotheses and as I’ve said before they WANT to believe in chemtrails.

  44. Uncinus… your probably one of the millions who think Cave dwellers from the middle east crashed the planes into the towers arent you? The evidence you present is no different than 9/11 Commissions report on the events of that day! Full of real science but totally bogus in relation to the event!

    Sure contrails can last awhile and spread out… I live in Alberta where its dry as a fart year round, and on a day with less than 20%Humidity and 65F weather we have trails that go from edge to edge of the city, in grid patterns, at multiple altitudes and last upwards of 2 hrs!!!

    The truth about chemtrails will never come out, just like the truth of 9/11 will never come out… they will continue to come up with cover ups and dis-info to keep you from the truth! If people knew the truth about such things as subliminal messaging, chemtrails, bombardment of ELF! they would never let such ludicrous actions take place!

    There was even an episode done on Unsolved Mysteries (in the 90’s) regarding chemtrails sprayed somewhere in California.

    If they admit to spraying for weather modification…cloud seeding etc how can you say that there is no Chemtrail activity on a daily basis being carried out over the general population?

  45. Who said ‘cave dwellers from the middle east’ crashed planes into the twin towers? What an ignorant, racist remark.

  46. Who said ‘cave dwellers from the middle east’ crashed planes into the twin towers? What an ignorant, racist remark.

    Umm, that would be the US Government!

  47. Sure contrails can last awhile and spread out… I live in Alberta where its dry as a fart year round, and on a day with less than 20%Humidity and 65F weather we have trails that go from edge to edge of the city, in grid patterns, at multiple altitudes and last upwards of 2 hrs!!!

    I’m going to have to write a post about this, so I can just link to it rather than having to explain it every time.

    Humidity at cruise altitude is unrelated to humidity at ground level.

    Temperature at cruise altitude is 100 to 140 degrees F cooler than at ground level. (-35.6F for every 10,000 feet)

  48. I can see you didn’t understand what I was trying to get at with the 9/11 Commission comment. Your science is sound… when applied to the right circumstances. And yes I understand this is not a 9/11 website! Okay so if 9/11 is a touchy subject for you…. I’m gonna guess your a believer in AGW as well? Theres another example of sound science being mis-treated and applied under the wrong circumstances!

    You can provide evidence all day that Humidity/Temp varies at different altitudes..anyone beyond grade 6 I hope would know this!..the real problem is the lack of instrumentation for everyday people to prove that Chemtrails exist! How do you explain pilots who have seen planes leaving trails right in front of them at the same altitude, but their plane is not creating its own “Contrail”. What about the dozens of reports by air craft controllers seeing visible streaks on their radar being created by aircraft on their monitors? What about the dozens and dozens of soil/snow samples taken by individuals after a spray session only to find Ridiculously high amounts of Aluminum, Barium etc. , levels much higher than any “Chemtrail Denier” could ever hope to be found in a real contrail.

    Do you really think a Government that covered up 9/11 and supports AGW is going to put any effort into providing tools or evidence to help prove chemtrails exist? No… and people like you only make it harder… with your seemingly endless knowledge of Contrails you should try and support efforts to disprove chemtrails! not simply provide evidence on the formation of contrails. Get in a plane do some fly overs… test some soil samples… talk to some aircraft controllers…set up time lapse videos of the sky, I think once YOU have taken the time to do these things you will realize there is an overwhelming basis on which to take the investigation further!

    Simply providing evidence on how Contrails are formed, and every white streak behind a plane must be a Contrail according to you, does nothing to help the debate.

    I will say, there are lots of people who say every white trail behind a plane is a chemtrail as well..hopefully they take the time to understand the science you provided and make better judgements.. but on the same note I think you need to do the same and have a more open mind to the possibility of them existing!

  49. How do you explain pilots who have seen planes leaving trails right in front of them at the same altitude, but their plane is not creating its own “Contrail”.

    How can they see their own contrails, or lack thereof?

    If the planes are at exactly the same altitude, then they will be separated by quite a distance. Too far to tell if they are actually at the same altitude.

    Different engines?

    http://contrailscience.com/skitch/AFD-051013-001_%283%29.pdf_%28page_4_of_14%29-20100311-161630.jpg

    Who are these pilots anyway? Why have they never spoken about this? How do you know they said it?

    What about the dozens of reports by air craft controllers seeing visible streaks on their radar being created by aircraft on their monitors? What about the dozens and dozens of soil/snow samples taken by individuals after a spray session only to find Ridiculously high amounts of Aluminum, Barium etc. , levels much higher than any “Chemtrail Denier” could ever hope to be found in a real contrail.

    What about them? I’d love to see them. In fact if you scroll to the top of this page you’ll see the post is actually intended as a place for putting the “best” evidence. So if you could provide links, then I’ll add them to the page.

  50. Man Bah- have you not read anything on this site at all? Go look at some of my posts and you’ll see the true pilot perspective.

  51. uncinus, if anything, that ctyforg guy is the one being immature. He said that you were immature? lol

    lets see, he called you guys names in every post, and cussed at you too, yeah, whos the immature one now!

  52. Its march 20th, and yes….
    there are persistent contrails creating persistent CLOUDS over me.
    In fact for the past week there has been plenty of persistent contrails.
    WTF Uncinus?

    Seems like the “rarity” of “Persistent Contrails” is pretty much a DAILY occurance.
    Wtf Uncinus?

  53. I never said they were rare. In fact if you look at the first page on this site, I quote a paper from 1970 that says spreading contrails are “a familiar sight”.

    It has been pretty clear over the last few days as I recall. There were briefly persisting contrails yesterday at around 6PM, but they did not spread.

    I can’t see any at the moment. It’s a bit hazy down here though.

    How many days in March would you expect to see persistent contrails, based on your personal experience? Looking at the key I prepared it seems quite plausible that at least half of them would have some contrails:

    http://c.contrailscience.com/thumbs/USA5.2009.terra.key.64.html

  54. UNCINUS, the time is 3:51pm in northeast Los Angeles.
    THE ENTIRE SKY looking SOUTH is WHITE. WHITE GLOWING WHITE.
    the ENTIRE SKY in all other directions is ALMOST pure GLOWING WHITE…
    AND you can see the PERSISTENT SPREADING CONTRAILS that created it.
    How do I know this? I’ve been up and out AND looking at the sky since 8 am.
    PERSISTENT CONTRAILS at 8am…now full WHITE sky. This is not natural clouds…this is CONTRAIL whiteout.

    AND i’ve got a few photos and video…just dont have the time to process, document and upload.

    WTF uncinus?

  55. What’s your question exactly?

    I see contrails now. For the past few hours the marine layer has been in, and we were enveloped in fog, but now it’s just rolled back to the beach. I just took this:

    Satellite is as you would expect, lots of high level clouds.

    http://rapidfire.sci.gsfc.nasa.gov/subsets/?subset=AERONET_La_Jolla.2010079.terra.500m

    Question for you: Before you noticed contrails, how much time did you spend looking at the sky each day? About the same as a regular person does now? The people who now don’t really notice contrails?

  56. I made some of those today over SoCal. All the contrails were fairly low today for some reason. Started around 27000 and nothing higher than 30000. Temps were pretty warm in the trails also. We were in them until about the four corners area and then they stopped.

  57. Well-it’s hard to say exactly but probably around -30c sat. Certainly nothing colder than -40c sat or so. With all the earlier talk of atmospheric layers I can tell you we were solidly in the troposhere.

    We saw the same in that system that rolled through the midwest earlier this week. Everything real low. I guess the systems aren’t in need of much upper level energy to get going. I watched the sky in St. Louis yesterday and saw the typical numerous contrails followed by an entirely thin upper level overcast. Honestly I can say why it’s so convincing that contrails are so evil. If you don’t know what’s going on “behind the scenes” it looks like one thing leads to another.

  58. Captfitch, that reminds me of a question from earlier. Can you see your own contrail if you are going in a straight line relative with zero crosswind?

    If not, then what about if you’ve got a significant crosswind?

    basically can you always tell if you are making contrails, or do you generally rely on visuals on other traffic?

  59. No amount of crosswind will allow you to see your contrail. Remember, the plane or anything coming out of the planes only “sees” zero wind from the moment we leave the ground.

    No- the only way you can tell if you are making a contrail is if you see your trail’s shadow (happens often) or if you infer that you are making trails because those around you are.

  60. Oops. I can see why people get confused now I get confused myself. I was thinking about the angle for extreme crosswind landings, but of course that’s only relative to the ground. If you are not turning, then the contrail will be directly behind you. I think.

  61. I live in Los Angeles CA and I can say without any doubt that chemtrails (perisitent contrails) are being sprayed by dozens of high altitude jets every day, even on cloudy days. To those of you who say the weather must be just right for contrails to be perisitant I have observed persistent contrails being sprayed AT THE SAME TIME as normal contrails are being sprayed. The normal one’s dissipate within a few seconds or so, the chemtrails stay for hours and eventually spread into cloud like formations. At times the sun is almost completely blocked… you can see jets laying their chemtrails in almost every direction. In the early AM the sky might be completely clear… within a couple of hours a poisonous haze is over my head from the clearly chemtrails being sprayed. This is never happend before to my knowledge… I have only begun to notice this phenomena the last month or so. To anyone debunking the chemtrail reality I say you are either working for whomever is spraying these things or you’re insane. Take your pick… these things are happening and they are poisoning the environment with aluminum, barium, strontium, and other metals and chemicals. THIS MUST STOP.

  62. Hi Moxaman, I’ve also noticed a lot of persistent contrail over the last few weeks. It’s the right kind of weather for it. But, you said:

    To those of you who say the weather must be just right for contrails to be perisitant I have observed persistent contrails being sprayed AT THE SAME TIME as normal contrails are being sprayed. The normal one’s dissipate within a few seconds or so, the chemtrails stay for hours and eventually spread into cloud like formations.

    That observation is explained here:

    http://contrailscience.com/why-do-some-planes-leave-long-trails-but-others-dont/

    Basically, the planes are at different altitudes.

  63. Hello Uncinus,

    Well I certainly hope to be proven wrong, but I’ve been living in the LA area for over 20 years and I’ve never seen phenomena like this. Even if a persistant contrail ligered, it wouldn’t linger for hours and eventually expand into a cloud like formation. But to be sure, I’m going to test some standing water that I have on my property. If there is elevated levels of aluminum and barium in it, that will give me all the proof I need that indeed we are being sprayed by chemtrails. You might want to read the following link. Levels of these metals have been found in air, soil, and water samples from Lake Shasta, CA that exceed by THOUSANDS of times normal levels. Citizens there have been complaining of chemtrails for a long time. I’ll let the board know what my water samples show. Air samples are being tested by another group as I type and should be ready in about two weeks. Here’s the link. http://www.blacklistednews.com/news-7958-0-5-5–.html

  64. Hello Unicnus and all,

    Having recently moved from LA to Central Oregon, I was surprised to note that the phenomena of planes lining the sky that I first noticed in LA in 1999, is occurring in Central Oregon as well. Even more so, the frequency of which seems to follow a pattern, which I’ve begun to chart since February.

    So, Uncinus, if persistent contrails are a truly natural byproduct of jet exhaust, how come for the entire months of February and March, they only occurred on Friday, Saturday and Sunday? You got that right, just as it’s happening out my window right now, here on Sunday Morning in Central Oregon, what you might call persistent contrails seem to exclusively occur on Friday, Saturday and Sunday’s. How is something like that natural?

    I realize I’m not presenting any photographic evidence, so my point is largely moot and easily dismissible. However, for the sake of this conversation, why don’t we all, in our respective areas, start to chart “chemtrail” days and see if any pattern emerges over the next month as there certainly seems to be over Central Oregon.

    Cheers,

  65. That’s an interesting observation. Possibly there’s more of certain types of flight at the weekend – but I don’t really think that would be the cause. Possibly also you have more free time on those days, and tend to notice contrails more?

    Most likely though is simple coincidence, perhaps combined with a bit of the above. If you’d like to investigate in more detail, I’d recommend you check the year’s satellite photos of your region, and see what the weather was like on each of the days in question. You can usually see contrails if you look on the larger images.

    http://rapidfire.sci.gsfc.nasa.gov/subsets/?subset=USA1

  66. Looks like about a roughly weekly cycle of persistant contrails- You should somehow look back at the weather in that area during the same time and chart the movemnt of weather systems. I would suspect that during that time there were lows moving through about once a week or so. This reminds me of some claims that chemtrails almost always occir on the warmest days of the week or before a major rain event. The latter claim is often used in the false cause and effect patterns of rain and chemtrails. I flew through several persistent contrails today over MS and AR in advance of that low positioned over eastern TX. I suspect that tomorrow there will be persistent contrails over AL, and GA.

  67. Regarding “chemtrail sickness”,

    I just became aware of chemtrails a few days ago and I am deeply disturbed by the fear mongering that’s going on. I’m especially upset by it’s effect on children. It tears my heart open when I hear about 7 and 8 year olds who are completly convinced that they are being methodically exterminated and start asking “why shouldn’t I just end it all now?”

    I believe your fear is real and your ill health genuine, but where else have you looked for explanations?

    Consider all of the chemicals we use on/in our cars, bodies, homes and yards on a regular basis—germicides, herbicides, insecticides, fragranced soaps, shampoos, fabric softeners, deodorants, perfumes, powders, a multitude of cleaning products, fabric fresheners and various pharaceuticals.

    I don’t want to come off as condescending. Just consider a mundane explanation. I know about this type of chemical overload from personal experience-it just kinda sneaks up on you. Since I’ve eliminated most of the above from my home, I’m feeling healthier than I have in a long time.

    And please don’t give the government more credit that it’s due. They can barely organize a cup of coffee let alone the elaborate overly complicated plots espoused in these types of conspiracies.

  68. A video posted on youtube as “proof”. Notice how confident that the person who posted it IS! This person actually “believes” he (she) has blown the lid off of the secret spray program. But, at the VERY first glance, someone who actually cares to understand airplanes, knows what these tanks are. It’s amazing how these people will just “assume” they understand what they see..

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ci4GN4Tt-lE

  69. Another person on youtube claimed that since they found the word “aerosol” in a proposal to solve global warming, it is “evidence” that someone is “spraying” something in the sky. “aerosol” = “chemtrails” apparently. Amazing.

  70. A common theme is the misiterpretation of scientific terms, like “radiative forcing”

    It possible that some of them are hoaxers, just saying stuff for fun.

  71. everybody go outside and look up…what do you see? go to the pet store and get ph test strips used for testing aquarium ph levels…set out a bucket or bowl of water (your tap water is most likely at the relative ph of your surrounding environment…test this water…write down the date and the reading. wait for a day or two (if it rains in the interum, this may affect your readings) and retest the water. please report any differences! i would like to add that i live in the southwestern us and i am an organic gardener. the number of insects(field roaches, crickets,grasshoppers,beetles,spiders,ants,bees,gnats,flies,etc….)are in sharp decline. i have fewer flowers,fruits,veges because they are not being pollinated by the regulars. i herald the first appearance of aphids(staple food for many beneficials-everybody’s got to eat.) this year…one infested plant!!! this is like the plankton dying off in the oceans…wait a minute…the plankton IS dying off in the oceans! TEST EVERYTHING!! soil, water, food, breastmilk!! WHY NOT? what’s a few dollars for testing…if there is nothing wrong we can all breathe a huge sigh of relief and go back to the important stuff, like money,power and war and the great game(where EVERYBODY WINS) of mine’s bigger. if there is something wrong then we probably should not leave it to the government to fix it…just saying(their record…). which means, to me, that we are going to have to go way out of our comfort zones, risk it (looking crazy)and inform EVERYONE to do their own testing. then WE are going to have to get together(MILLIONS OF US WILL ONLY MAKE A DENT….)and decide what is important for the future…i vote for “FIRST DO NO HARM”. thanks for the outlet. DO YOUR OWN RESEARCH AND DECIDE FOR YOURSELF!

  72. uncinus-hope this finds you well. this is frustrating. i have only my experiences to go on. i am not a scientist. here is what i know..the ph of the water here is 6.8 to 7. when it rains here there is a distinct odor-desert dust, juniper and alkiline soil. when it rains after a chemtrailly day(rare)THERE IS NO ODOR, there is strange thunder that lasts too long-with no visible lightening and the rain water is acidic! the plants seem to have been dehydrated rather than hydrated…limp. there is a curious “dryness” that is not present after a normal rain where plants and soil(even after a light sprinkle) stay at least a little moist-good turger pressure. this is not anything i have experienced before-it is odd-notable. no, i have no way of linking this to contrails…but something is not right…and the “wrong” seems to be taking place in the sky. the turqoise sky(almost painfully blue) IS missing. clear skies ARE rarer. something else odd-if you watch tv, note how many programs and advertising have chemtrails in the background…and how few show bright blue skies…setting up a bucket tomorrow-will keep you posted. thanks for your interest.

  73. Hello t good to see someone else that likes clear skies and is trying find out why they are so rare these days.

  74. hey! hope everyone had a pleasant memorial day! no change in ph. uncinus-how old are you? i’m fifty. how long have you been flying? just wondered if you had been around long enough to note any significant changes in the sky. off to see my sister in pheonix..back in a couple days…if i don’t spontaneously burst into flames! hot!hot!hot!

  75. I: hey! hope everyone had a pleasant holiday! no ph changes noted
    I returned from England to the Canaries yesterday.
    At Luton the weather was very cool (18 deg C), with very low clouds and scotch mist/drizzle.
    When the Boeing 737 levelled off (to my astonishment) it was STILL in overcast conditions, and remained there for nearly an hour, by which time it had cleared slightly, giving snatches of blue above, and sea below.
    Aircraft (they were all passenger aircraft) passing in the opposte direction did so (positionally) from eleven to five o’clock, shooting by at an apparent speed of 1000 mph, and throwing dense trails, through which we flew after a minute or two, with a slight feeling of “roughness”. I could see and feel that the pilot (or autopilot) made a slight course change to starboard about every ten minutes throughout the flight through this semi-overcast section.
    The trails formed a “sawtooth” pattern, and it was east to see that these sawteeth were mass-produced “sylphs”, cones of falling ice where the ice was falling more quickly down the central axis of each sylph.
    After about three hours of the four-hour flight our plane entered more typical conditions, and we landed a quarter of an hour ahead of schedule.
    The overcast part of the flight was conducted within a jet stream aligned about fifteen degrees away from the north/south route of the flight.

  76. hello all! slight change in ph, now 7.2-7.8. happy to report lots of bugs in the water! are bugs acidic? i have decided to attempt to ignore the sky and focus on what’s important at the moment, which is family, health, art, and feeling grateful! my grandson just lost a tooth and his parents rewarded him with a mohawk-which really is more fun than a quarter! “the best revenge is to live well!” “the person who says it cannot be done should not interrupt the person doing it.”

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